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BBHS 
bbhs
Joined: 30 Jun 2004
Location: Bellarine
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| So Port seem to completely shut down the middle of the ground and our switching didn't seem to free this up. Hoping we have a good plan for the Hawks as we run them off there feet last time. |
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qldmagpie67
Joined: 18 Dec 2008
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It's very simple this week
Play Langdon lose by 5+ goals
Don't play him and we can win
Simple as that.
Before the Langdon lovers come out in force crying look at it logically.
If Langdon plays they will isolate Bruest Gunston or Scilliy on him deep inside 50 and he will like last weekend be made look silly by much better high class footballers.
He is a ball watcher not reader. He doesn't have the pace to make up for his errors in judgement and his very ordinary in 1-1 contests.
You all knock Scharenberg and his lack of pace which is fair after 2 knees but he doesn't need to be as quick because he reads the play so well and can make the good decisions to leave his man and intercept mark or spoil.
The class difference between Langdon and Scharenberg is massive Scharenberg has it Langdon doesn't
Go watch the first quarter of last weekends game and see how Langdon was directly and soley responsible for 3 first term goals to port because of his lack of match awareness and lack of skill.
He gave them the head start they love having they love playing from in front and he handed that to them in the first term. The MCG isn't being enough for us to find somewhere to hide him.
Clarkson would have watched that and seen his avenue to goal right there.
Our backline the past 2 weeks has for the first times this season looked really shaky when before it looked quite solid. My belief is the other backs don't have the confidence in Langdon's decision making and are nervously watching him and his opponent.
Last weekend highlighted how a smart coach will isolate the weakest link in your defence and make you pay time and again. They moved Goldie to Robbie Gray so Port sent Sam Gray to Langdon immediate success feeding a pass inside 50 for a goal.
If port had capitalised on there ball movement better watch the replay and see how many times Langdon had let Robbie Gray get 5-10m clear of him deep inside 50. Luckily for us there was some errant passes and good defensive work upfield stopped the entries or Gray would have kicked 10.
Hoping Elliott and Varcoe are both available we need an injection of class badly. |
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5150 
Joined: 31 Aug 2005
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Until Elliott or Varcoe are confirmed playing.
Out - Crocker, Brown
In - Mayne, Cox
Greenwood out of the forward line and fill the midfield grunt job for Brown.
Mayne in for Crocker, Cox to stand in the goal square until Grundy needs a rest. Moore can just run around playing catch the soap. |
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WarrenerraW
Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Location: Melbourne
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| Ball movement needs to improve and it's as simple as that. We had 70 odd more disposals than port but still got flogged. Our players need to spread and put themselves in attacking positions rather than hang around the packs for a cheap kick or handball. Doing so will free up our forward line and allow the likes of Moore and fasolo to be a genuine target rather than trying to mark against two opponents everytime. If we ate prepared to run and work hard to create space then we win. |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| How does doing that make you feel? |
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derkd
Joined: 29 May 2013
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If recent seasons are any guide we are in for a long ride home ..... under Bucks our post bye form has been patchy at best and indeed some years (2015 for example we won two games)...not meaning that as to suggest that it is his fault. I hope they prove me wrong...but I get the feeling we are going to struggle given the draw and our shallow depth. To put simply, we just don't have the scoring power (Mr.Obvious i know) but for a side to be so reliant on a young full forward (Moore) and a crafty small forward in Elliott is a real shame. The club did not go hard enough for a replacement for Cloke once he was out the door....that could be academic as our delivery into the forward line is simply awful anyway.
I could be wrong but it really feels to me that our midfield has not hit the scoreboard this year.
Should we win against Hawthorn....well we can keep dreaming of September...faint as it may be. Lose and the club really need to turn attention to list and club...time to start sorting who stays and leaves, and awarding games to those who will be part of the coming season(s).
_________________
"To know nothing of events before your birth, is to forever remain a child" - Cicero (Roman Lawyer/Senator) 46 BCE.
Last edited by derkd on Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:01 pm; edited 4 times in total |
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ad4eva 
Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Location: The 'G'
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Without the sweeping changes, it doesn't take much to go back to what looked so dangerous and suited our game style just 6 quarters of footy ago.
Although Cox may be improving he is still a long way off AFL standard to be considered a key forward. Ben Reid is now back and our defence was just as great without him. Reid is ahead of Cox as a key forward and starts there.
In: Scharenberg, Varcoe, Mayne
Out: Langdon, Aish, Crocker
Langdon ---> Scharenberg - I thought Scharenberg was stiff to start with. This guy remains in our side until years end. Unfortunately with Langdon, for every good piece of footy you get, there is some bad shortly after.
Aish ---> Varcoe - Aish has been ok, but during a week we looked slow between the flanks, Varcoe fills the wing/half back to suit this need.
Crocker ---> Mayne - Crocker has had another valuable taste but he just hasn't been able to compete. I don't doubt the talent is there but sometimes as a forward your roll is to apply a bit of grunt to just cause a stoppage and hold the footy inside fifty. Mayne's form warrants a recall and will be able to do this better than what Crocker has.
Notes:
- Phillips is marginally ahead of Aish but offers more with his leg speed.
- Cal Brown may not have found a heap of it but I think he offers more than Crocker at this stage. Id also like to see a 5-6 game run at the big time before we give him a spell.
- In the absence of Reid from defence, over the past month a combination of Dunn, Goldsack and Scharenberg worked well to combat the talls of the opposition.
- If we use the ball moving forward like we did on Saturday, no matter the changes rung, we will beat no one. |
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thompsoc
Joined: 21 Sep 2009
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The question for this round is:
Is it about getting games into the young players like Brown
or is it about still trying to get to the finals.
Important question.
_________________
we don't eat our own at collingwood we just allow them to foul our nest. |
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RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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| ad4eva wrote: | Without the sweeping changes, it doesn't take much to go back to what looked so dangerous and suited our game style just 6 quarters of footy ago.
Although Cox may be improving he is still a long way off AFL standard to be considered a key forward. Ben Reid is now back and our defence was just as great without him. Reid is ahead of Cox as a key forward and starts there.
In: Scharenberg, Varcoe, Mayne
Out: Langdon, Aish, Crocker
Langdon ---> Scharenberg - I thought Scharenberg was stiff to start with. This guy remains in our side until years end. Unfortunately with Langdon, for every good piece of footy you get, there is some bad shortly after.
Aish ---> Varcoe - Aish has been ok, but during a week we looked slow between the flanks, Varcoe fills the wing/half back to suit this need.
Crocker ---> Mayne - Crocker has had another valuable taste but he just hasn't been able to compete. I don't doubt the talent is there but sometimes as a forward your roll is to apply a bit of grunt to just cause a stoppage and hold the footy inside fifty. Mayne's form warrants a recall and will be able to do this better than what Crocker has.
Notes:
- Phillips is marginally ahead of Aish but offers more with his leg speed.
- Cal Brown may not have found a heap of it but I think he offers more than Crocker at this stage. Id also like to see a 5-6 game run at the big time before we give him a spell.
- In the absence of Reid from defence, over the past month a combination of Dunn, Goldsack and Scharenberg worked well to combat the talls of the opposition.
- If we use the ball moving forward like we did on Saturday, no matter the changes rung, we will beat no one. |
Fair enough arguments, but I disagree on a couple of points.
1. Scharenberg is even slower than Langdon and has no physicality or any lateral movement in his dodgy knees. He's so far from being AFL ready right now it's not funny. Sadly, despite his precocious talent, his chronic injuries may have ended his career before it's really started. Let him play out the year in the VFL and hope he is in better physical shape next year.
2. Reid is fast nearing the end of his career. He looks like a shadow of his former self. At least in defence he seems to be less injury prone, so I wouldn't even think of moving him.
I agree it's time to give Mayne a chance, but I'd also give Cox one final chance to prove me wrong. I doubt Varcoe will be available, but we could bring in Wills and unleash the Kirbinator.
Aish, Crocker, Brown and Broomhead, are not good enough atm, so they should all go back to the VFL. |
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ThePieMind
Joined: 11 Apr 2009
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| qldmagpie67 wrote: | It's very simple this week
Play Langdon lose by 5+ goals
Don't play him and we can win
Simple as that.
Before the Langdon lovers come out in force crying look at it logically.
If Langdon plays they will isolate Bruest Gunston or Scilliy on him deep inside 50 and he will like last weekend be made look silly by much better high class footballers.
He is a ball watcher not reader. He doesn't have the pace to make up for his errors in judgement and his very ordinary in 1-1 contests.
You all knock Scharenberg and his lack of pace which is fair after 2 knees but he doesn't need to be as quick because he reads the play so well and can make the good decisions to leave his man and intercept mark or spoil.
The class difference between Langdon and Scharenberg is massive Scharenberg has it Langdon doesn't
Go watch the first quarter of last weekends game and see how Langdon was directly and soley responsible for 3 first term goals to port because of his lack of match awareness and lack of skill.
He gave them the head start they love having they love playing from in front and he handed that to them in the first term. The MCG isn't being enough for us to find somewhere to hide him.
Clarkson would have watched that and seen his avenue to goal right there.
Our backline the past 2 weeks has for the first times this season looked really shaky when before it looked quite solid. My belief is the other backs don't have the confidence in Langdon's decision making and are nervously watching him and his opponent.
Last weekend highlighted how a smart coach will isolate the weakest link in your defence and make you pay time and again. They moved Goldie to Robbie Gray so Port sent Sam Gray to Langdon immediate success feeding a pass inside 50 for a goal.
If port had capitalised on there ball movement better watch the replay and see how many times Langdon had let Robbie Gray get 5-10m clear of him deep inside 50. Luckily for us there was some errant passes and good defensive work upfield stopped the entries or Gray would have kicked 10.
Hoping Elliott and Varcoe are both available we need an injection of class badly. |
While I dont agree with everything you said about Langdon - I do believe that playing him in the VFL, will enable him to build his confidence in the way Shazz has.
You can't intercept mark like he does without being able to read the play. |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| RudeBoy wrote: | | ad4eva wrote: | Without the sweeping changes, it doesn't take much to go back to what looked so dangerous and suited our game style just 6 quarters of footy ago.
Although Cox may be improving he is still a long way off AFL standard to be considered a key forward. Ben Reid is now back and our defence was just as great without him. Reid is ahead of Cox as a key forward and starts there.
In: Scharenberg, Varcoe, Mayne
Out: Langdon, Aish, Crocker
Langdon ---> Scharenberg - I thought Scharenberg was stiff to start with. This guy remains in our side until years end. Unfortunately with Langdon, for every good piece of footy you get, there is some bad shortly after.
Aish ---> Varcoe - Aish has been ok, but during a week we looked slow between the flanks, Varcoe fills the wing/half back to suit this need.
Crocker ---> Mayne - Crocker has had another valuable taste but he just hasn't been able to compete. I don't doubt the talent is there but sometimes as a forward your roll is to apply a bit of grunt to just cause a stoppage and hold the footy inside fifty. Mayne's form warrants a recall and will be able to do this better than what Crocker has.
Notes:
- Phillips is marginally ahead of Aish but offers more with his leg speed.
- Cal Brown may not have found a heap of it but I think he offers more than Crocker at this stage. Id also like to see a 5-6 game run at the big time before we give him a spell.
- In the absence of Reid from defence, over the past month a combination of Dunn, Goldsack and Scharenberg worked well to combat the talls of the opposition.
- If we use the ball moving forward like we did on Saturday, no matter the changes rung, we will beat no one. |
Fair enough arguments, but I disagree on a couple of points.
1. Scharenberg is even slower than Langdon and has no physicality or any lateral movement in his dodgy knees. He's so far from being AFL ready right now it's not funny. Sadly, despite his precocious talent, his chronic injuries may have ended his career before it's really started. Let him play out the year in the VFL and hope he is in better physical shape next year.
2. Reid is fast nearing the end of his career. He looks like a shadow of his former self. At least in defence he seems to be less injury prone, so I wouldn't even think of moving him.
I agree it's time to give Mayne a chance, but I'd also give Cox one final chance to prove me wrong. I doubt Varcoe will be available, but we could bring in Wills and unleash the Kirbinator.
Aish, Crocker, Brown and Broomhead, are not good enough atm, so they should all go back to the VFL. |
We can't win finals if we can't kick a winning score. Darcy can't do it as the only tall when our midfield is under pressure and can't run the ball or spot kicks to a small forward. We need a second tall forward.
I'd play Cox for the remainder of the season and see if he can earn a new contract.
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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qldmagpie67
Joined: 18 Dec 2008
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Most of our problems always seem to stem from lack of pressure or application.
Until last week we had at least every game prior given a decent to good account of ourselves and had actually lost games we should have won but for poor goal kicking.
Being 5-8 and needing to win 7 more games to make finals (not impossible just improbable on lasts weeks effort) I think we should really try and change things up.
This is the side in position I would pick (allowing for Elliott and Varcoe to be fit to return this week)
B. Ramsay. Dunn. Howe
HB. Scharenberg. Reid. Goldie
C. Varcoe. Treloar. Maynard
HF. JDG. Moore. Faz
F. Elliott. WHE. Sidey
R. Grundy. Adams. Pendles
Int. Phillips. Crisp. Greenwood. Broomy
Out. Langdon (not ready for AFL yet) Brown (ditto) Aish
In. Ramsay. Varcoe. Elliott
Maynard plays around the contest and uses his physical strength clears some paths and his long boot to get it inside 50 (he's also not a bad shot on goal)
WHE plays out of the goal square he would be to quick for Gibson and he plays way taller than his height plus he's a very good mark and near our best kick at goal
Sidey and JDG play the front and centre types
Elliott plays taller and Moore and Faz as lead up types
(I would also try young Schade up forward in the seconds to see how he goes might be worth a try)
Ramsay gives us more pace down back and Scharenberg more skill to hit up targets
We need a stable defence that can play a few different roles |
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Presti35 
Dick Lee for Legend Status
Joined: 05 Oct 2001
Location: London, England
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| thompsoc wrote: | The question for this round is:
Is it about getting games into the young players like Brown
or is it about still trying to get to the finals?
Important question. |
A bloody tough question, difficult to answer.
We cannot win the flag. I think we can all agree there.
IMO, we're not going to be able to make the top 8 from here with the run home that we have. It's not impossible, but it's a massive ask.
We haven't been winning the games we should be winning, so I think getting games into younger players is the most important thing now.
_________________
A Goal Saved Is 2 Goals Earned! |
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Damien 
Me Noah & Flynn @ the G
Joined: 21 Jan 1999
Location: Croydon Vic
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I don't think it's a case of getting games into every young player we can. It's horses for courses. I think Callum Brown is worthy of another game and Shaz has earned a recall. Broomhead might need to go back to the VFL and Cox (who is one of our young brigade) has earned it too. Aish not sure. I'd like to see Kirby get a crack though. How did Schade go in the VFL?
_________________
'Collingwood are the Bradmans of Football'
The Herald - 1930 |
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burnsy17
Joined: 10 Aug 2003
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It's time to push Howe forward.
Tall backs: Reid, Dunn with Goldy taking their 3rd tall.
Forwards - assuming Elliott / Varcoe are not fit yet.
Fasolo Moore DeGoey
Howe Cox Mayne
_________________
Beware the swooping Magpie. |
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