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Is Buckley coaching better than we think...?

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qldmagpie67 



Joined: 18 Dec 2008


PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:19 pm
Post subject: Is Buckley coaching better than we think ?Reply with quote

I was watching "On the couch" and Lyons made a couple interesting comments on Bucks coaching and I thought have I messed something.
He stated that when we went 4 goals down that Buckley put Reid and Cox on the bench the went small all around the contests and set a forward line of smalls who could pressure and slow the ball movement down. He also highlighted the role Pendles played on Cripps and a take from Pendles on SEN Pendles said "Bucks came to me during the week and said we need to shut down Cripps at the contest and challenged me to do it"" It wasn't a run with role I still had the opportunity to do my own thing but I enjoyed the challenge of playing on the new good players in the competition"
So I went and had a look at the footage and Lyons was right Buckley made moves maybe it didn't win the game but it certainly halted there momentum and the tide turned soon after our way.
Likewise the Pendles move was a winner for us. He always played Cripps tight at the contest and didn't leave his side until the ball left the contest then Pendles went and did his own thing.
Buckley in years past has been critiqued heavily for not making moves during the course of a game.
He's also shown willingness to use Sidey Trelaor as FF and each time it's made a impact on the scoreboard.
The analysts watch the game differently than us fans and maybe we as fans miss some things that happen during the game.
I for one am happy to see a more flexible coach who's not afraid to roll the dice when things aren't going our way.
Maybe this weekend Pendles can go to Sloane and cut his impact down. Maybe we see Reid play back to help out the defence against some very good tall timber. Maybe we play extra smalls to give us more leg speed as its been a weakness in the crows team for a while
Chris Scott also made a interesting comment that due to the evenness of the comp outside 4 sides that it may mean sides can be alive and in finals hunt a lot longer
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Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:39 pm
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Fans know little about coaching. It’s why so many have such strong opinions on it.

Buckley has been a good coach for a few seasons, getting competitive performances out of a very ordinary, often injury-depleted list.

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Pies2016 



Joined: 12 Sep 2014


PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:44 pm
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Some interesting observations.
Personally, when we get some mid field depth back, I would like to see Pendlebury “ run with “ ( not hard tag ) particular opposition guns more often.
The best way to nullify a gun player is to put someone on him like Pendlebury, who can cause as much damage when Collingwood have the ball.
It makes the opposition mid way more accountable and in a more reactive position at the contest. Pendles has the engine to go with anyone and he can’t be taken down to the goal line to create a height mismatch.
Cripps was a good decision because they really couldn’t win without Cripps having a big game.
We also need to move on from our reliance on Pendles and learn to spread the load a bit better. It does seem to be happening a little bit more of late, so maybe thats another good reason to change his role on field.
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stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:45 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

In general, people see what they want to see.

Supporters pissed off after a loss, look for scapegoats. People in the football media, when they act without an agenda, can provide an insight independent of emotion.

Coaching a team requires a number of different elements.

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Piesnchess 

piesnchess


Joined: 09 Jun 2008


PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:49 pm
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I wonder at times just HOW Bucks would have gone, if just for ONCE, he had a fully fit, healthy list at his disposal, something he has NEVER had in any season. Like what Hardwick has, a fit, SETTLED team. !
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Leggie Aries

Bucks for PM.


Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Location: Perth

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:57 pm
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I rate him
A fit squad and the results would speak for themselves and a lot more would rate him.
Regardless I rate him.

Go Pies

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Skids Cancer

Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.


Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:20 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

Mugwump wrote:
Fans know little about coaching. It’s why so many have such strong opinions on it.

Buckley has been a good coach for a few seasons, getting competitive performances out of a very ordinary, often injury-depleted list.


Spot on Mugwump... just waiting for the usual ignoramus posts from the gurus to come.........

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swoop42 Virgo

Whatcha gonna do when he comes for you?


Joined: 02 Aug 2008
Location: The 18

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:24 pm
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We beat Carlton.

They might well finish bottom 2.

Some perspective please.

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AN_Inkling 



Joined: 06 Oct 2007


PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 12:03 am
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Talking about counter narrative views on our coach: the one that has confused me is that we are inconsistent and that this may be due to Buckley's inability to motivate the team.

On results, we were one of the most consistently competitive teams last season. Whether we had players out or not, we were in pretty much every game we played. We lost some games we might have expected to win, but in one of the more even seasons everyone did this.

There are two main things I look for from a well coached team:
1) are they well organised?
2) do they compete consistently?

Last year, I'd strongly answer yes to both for Buckley's Pies. In previous years we have lacked organisation, but this has improved continually and last year we reached the expected standard. Due to this we often performed above our ability, one of the strongest indicators of quality coaching.

Of course, most of the time coaching is simply judged on results. This is far too simplistic and the number one benefit of Buckley's strong ties to Ed is that he's unlikely to be sacked simply based on results. If you have a coach who you believe is capable, sticking by them and providing stability will be much more likely to bring results than panicking about how long you've been out of the eight and making a change.

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Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 12:12 am
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^ absolutely correct. Results do tell a tale, across time, but they are a very blunt indicator. Ultimately, a coach has to achieve results, but a wise person looks at context, luck, the materials that the coach has to work with, and change across time.

If a single chaotic ball had bounced slightly differently on one occasion in 2010, many would consider/ remember Malthouse as a failed coach across 1999-2011. Instead, we consider him a great. In truth, he’d have been a very good coach however that ball had bounced. But he had a lot more to work with than Nathan has had since 2012.

I said elsewhere that I believe we can see the tide turning, and the talent flow improving, with last weekend just another positive indicator. When the tide does turn and we are resurgent, it will be due to the fact that McGuire has had the courage and vision to stick with a sensible plan despite the turbulence and the learning curve. We are a fortunate club to have a President strong enough to do this.

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RudeBoy 



Joined: 28 Nov 2005


PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 12:36 am
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What do you mean "we" pale face?

I'm one who has thought Bucks has been coaching well for 2-3 years, but has been badly let down by instability within our footy department and a shocking run with injuries to key players. The fact that even though we have missed finals footy for some time now, we have not been easy to beat either. That's a testament to Bucks' coaching prowess imo.

He's always struck me as someone with an incredible football brain, and that all he needed was a bit of luck along the way to be a successful coach. I realise it's only week 3, but I sense the tide has begun to turn and we are on an upward trajectory. Go Bucks and go Pies!


Last edited by RudeBoy on Tue Apr 10, 2018 12:40 am; edited 1 time in total
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bally12 Aquarius



Joined: 30 Sep 2010


PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 12:39 am
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We are looking much more organised defensively. Players seem to know where they should be and actively directing their teammates out on the field.
I've seen a few times the opposition wanting to move the ball quickly, only to look up and see we have them all covered...TICK.

Except for the first round, our effort and pressure has been good. One of the GWS players commenting it's as good as Tigs...TICK.

We've seen some signs of players taking the next step in their development. See Aish, Phillips, Grundy, Thomas, Brown, Crisp, throw in Murray as well....TICK.

We have mids that can be super dangerous as forwards...Treloar, Sidey, Degoey. Seems like the penny has dropped with Bucks on this point.....TICK.

Blair is in the 2's ...TICK (sorry that's a bit mean, but last year he was our deep forward going for the pack marks).

We seem to have "got" the fact we have to transition fast when we want to attack, including going via the corridor. Players like Murray encouraged to take the game on. Sideways and backwards movement only when we want a breather and play tempo/possession footy....TICK.

Some good signs, better than I can remember for a few years. We need to see more games to make a better judgment. Now if only we could kick Shocked
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Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 12:43 am
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^ Let’s hope so. I have wavered, but never stopped believing, and I think we can see the dawn breaking now. It would be a great joy to see the light streaming through after these difficult (but not hopeless) years. We’re not there yet, but I am confident it’s coming as the talent base rises.
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Culprit Cancer



Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne

PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 6:02 am
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After 7 years in the job, I seriously would hope he has improved in the actual job. Once again he has the best excuse in injuries and in saying that a good coach is someone that has coached a team that has been at the bottom and at the top. A weeks a long time in football and let's revisit this in round 10.
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The Boy Who Cried Wolf 



Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Location: We prefer free speech - you know it's right

PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 6:36 am
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I'll admit he's improved a LOT from when he started as our coach (because he was pretty bad and it'd be hard not to have improved after 7 years in the job). But he still has glaring issues 1. personality/empathy problems 2. he NEVER accepts fault, blame or responsibility 3. non dynamic/rigid tactically - this has also improved but is still imo weak as he doesn't adjust his style/plans to what we have actually have available and in the past has had an inability to think on his feet 'in game' 4. his recruiting policies (he tells them what he wants and ultimately calls the shots) has been reactionary or short term in general and mostly stop gap, hence our mini rebuilds have been poor - its a measure that he's felt we were a lot closer than we actually have been. Overcoming injuries, is factored in point 3.

We've won one game this year against a side that is clearly worse then us so we need to continue to hold our breath for now, but upto this point based on the past - its clear he's been a failure.

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