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Geek
geek
Joined: 06 Apr 2006
Location: Jacana
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| Bob Sugar wrote: | | Geek wrote: |
Yeah look. No doubt it has an impact in that manner. I'd reckon the bigger impact as far as rotations goes is that a mid (for example) would have had to stay on longer as he needed to spend extra time on field pinch hitting down back. Fair enough.
Still think the bigger issue was that we lost 2 of our most important intercept defenders. If those 'outs' had have been spread across different parts of the field, it wouldn't have been as much of a problem. |
Doesn't matter who you lose, they have to be replaced, you always have to rob Peter to pay Paul, rotations wouldn't change much between losing 2 mids and 2 backs, you're still down 2. |
Losing 2 backs vs losing a back and a forward isn't about rotations. We lost 2 specialist players from the same area of the ground. Lose one and you can stretch and make a fist of covering the out, which is what we did down back in quarters 2 and 3. Had we have lost a forward instead of Schaz, then the forward line might also have been able to adapt.
Instead it was 2 pretty important backmen and we didn't have the coverage for that big a hole. Yes, rotations are more important than I initially stated but I think that issue ran second to our structural problems, especially after we lost Schaz |
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Bob Sugar
Joined: 11 Feb 2010
Location: Benalla
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| Geek wrote: | | Bob Sugar wrote: | | Geek wrote: |
Yeah look. No doubt it has an impact in that manner. I'd reckon the bigger impact as far as rotations goes is that a mid (for example) would have had to stay on longer as he needed to spend extra time on field pinch hitting down back. Fair enough.
Still think the bigger issue was that we lost 2 of our most important intercept defenders. If those 'outs' had have been spread across different parts of the field, it wouldn't have been as much of a problem. |
Doesn't matter who you lose, they have to be replaced, you always have to rob Peter to pay Paul, rotations wouldn't change much between losing 2 mids and 2 backs, you're still down 2. |
Losing 2 backs vs losing a back and a forward isn't about rotations. We lost 2 specialist players from the same area of the ground. Lose one and you can stretch and make a fist of covering the out, which is what we did down back in quarters 2 and 3. Had we have lost a forward instead of Schaz, then the forward line might also have been able to adapt.
Instead it was 2 pretty important backmen and we didn't have the coverage for that big a hole. Yes, rotations are more important than I initially stated but I think that issue ran second to our structural problems, especially after we lost Schaz |
Not doubting that, i was just responding about rotations, they don't change no matter who you lose, if you're 2 down you're 2 down, the midfield can still operate but your forwards and defenders don't get a rest, this affects team balance, lower forward pressure, tired defenders etc.
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Defender...........
On the day before the first, Daicos created God.
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E
Joined: 05 May 2010
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| Geek wrote: | | Bob Sugar wrote: | | Geek wrote: |
Yeah look. No doubt it has an impact in that manner. I'd reckon the bigger impact as far as rotations goes is that a mid (for example) would have had to stay on longer as he needed to spend extra time on field pinch hitting down back. Fair enough.
Still think the bigger issue was that we lost 2 of our most important intercept defenders. If those 'outs' had have been spread across different parts of the field, it wouldn't have been as much of a problem. |
Doesn't matter who you lose, they have to be replaced, you always have to rob Peter to pay Paul, rotations wouldn't change much between losing 2 mids and 2 backs, you're still down 2. |
Losing 2 backs vs losing a back and a forward isn't about rotations. We lost 2 specialist players from the same area of the ground. Lose one and you can stretch and make a fist of covering the out, which is what we did down back in quarters 2 and 3. Had we have lost a forward instead of Schaz, then the forward line might also have been able to adapt.
Instead it was 2 pretty important backmen and we didn't have the coverage for that big a hole. Yes, rotations are more important than I initially stated but I think that issue ran second to our structural problems, especially after we lost Schaz |
I do agree with you that losing two players from the same area is MUCH MUCH harder to cover. We did our best to cover for Howe but had no one left once Scharenberg went down.
Without wanting to de-emphasize your point, i think it is also absolutely the case that losing two rotations on the bench was an equally critical factor (this doesn't mean the players rotate through the middle - it means there are four bench spots to allow mids to rest, and since they couldn't come off, they couldn't get that rest).
We were spent at the end there. I suspect not being able to give our runners a rest played a significant role in exacerbating that problem. We literally had nothing in the tank. when Cox marked at 50, not one person had the energy to present for him or give him an option. It was really noticeable.
To emphasize how important this is, when WHE hurt himself a couple of weeks ago, we put him up forward and said just give us what you can. We did this because it was deemed better to have an under-performing forward than it was to lose a rotation.
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Ohhh, the Premiership's a cakewalk ....... |
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Bob Sugar
Joined: 11 Feb 2010
Location: Benalla
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I thought the Tigers were a jerry to our handball game through the middle, we just lacked that one running sidestep to break them open, we played into their hands a bit IMO, they predicted where the ball was going, they zone well and don't get sucked into contests they can't influence, pretty impressive IMO.
Offensively they aren't a great midfield, but in open play their defensive work is as good as i've seen.
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Defender...........
On the day before the first, Daicos created God.
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Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
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| Culprit wrote: | | I deal in reality and in my view the Scoreboard flattered us. The Tigers were in control all day and when it mattered they kicked away. We are getting some quality games into some players and will be better for it and in saying that we are not quite there. Sure injuries don't help but that's football. It was a tough game and we will benefit from it. Good teams bounce back after a loss and we need to win next week. |
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Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
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Magpietothemax 
magpietothemax
Joined: 28 Apr 2013
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| Piesnchess wrote: | | Culprit wrote: | | I deal in reality and in my view the Scoreboard flattered us. The Tigers were in control all day and when it mattered they kicked away. We are getting some quality games into some players and will be better for it and in saying that we are not quite there. Sure injuries don't help but that's football. It was a tough game and we will benefit from it. Good teams bounce back after a loss and we need to win next week. |
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Agree. Good teams bounce back. We need to win next week. But don't agree with your assessment that today's game proves we're are not quite there. We were playing literally our B grade team due to injuries. Yet, had we not been two rotations down, victory was possible in the last. The most important point is that our B grade team can be strengthened in the near future with A graders if somehow we get a break and they can come in.
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Free Julian Assange!!
Ice in the veins |
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Bob Sugar
Joined: 11 Feb 2010
Location: Benalla
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| Magpietothemax wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | | Culprit wrote: | | I deal in reality and in my view the Scoreboard flattered us. The Tigers were in control all day and when it mattered they kicked away. We are getting some quality games into some players and will be better for it and in saying that we are not quite there. Sure injuries don't help but that's football. It was a tough game and we will benefit from it. Good teams bounce back after a loss and we need to win next week. |
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Agree. Good teams bounce back. We need to win next week. But don't agree with your assessment that today's game proves we're are not quite there. We were playing literally our B grade team due to injuries. Yet, had we not been two rotations down, victory was possible in the last. The most important point is that our B grade team can be strengthened in the near future with A graders if somehow we get a break and they can come in. |
If we remained healthy for the game it goes down to the wire IMO, if Richmond were 2 players down we win by 5 goals.
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Defender...........
On the day before the first, Daicos created God.
You like this. |
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Piethagoras' Theorem
the hypotenuse, is always a cakewalk
Joined: 29 May 2006
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Nothing much else to add here other than, I wouldn't mind meeting them week 1 in the finals with DeGoey, Treloar, Elliott and Aish back in and Howe playing 100 mins. Quite simple, if we have anything close to our best 22 available, we beat this mob by 5 goals
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Formally frankiboy and FrankieGoesToCollingwood. |
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RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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| FWIW, I thought Langdon was terrific. He stood up and became our General down back, organising the defence. He showed great leadership. |
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Pipes1970
Joined: 03 Jul 2017
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| RudeBoy wrote: | | FWIW, I thought Langdon was terrific. He stood up and became our General down back, organising the defence. He showed great leadership. |
Agreed... he was fantastic all day
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It doesn't matter what happens.... I just love this bloody club! |
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dalyc 
Joined: 02 Mar 2005
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| Bob Sugar wrote: | Embrace the horror guys, we're screwed.
History's a good judge, Moore-Elliott-Reid-Varcoe will be in rehab again before to long, hope history's wrong BTW but i'm doubting it, just isn't our year.
We really need to make some hard/brave/cold calls come seasons end. |
Oh God, not you again?
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Four legged animals good, two legged animals better |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| RudeBoy wrote: | | FWIW, I thought Langdon was terrific. He stood up and became our General down back, organising the defence. He showed great leadership. |
Actually, I think it was during the second quarter, down the Ponsford end, Richmond kicked a goal and as everyone was jogging back to their starting positions, Maynard called all the defenders in, they formed a ring and he gave instructions for about 15 seconds before they all split again.
I was impressed by the young bloke.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Albert Parker
Joined: 13 Dec 2012
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^^Yep, not a great game for the anti-Langdon mob. He was terrific.
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One team, one dream - the Pies and this year's premiership |
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GreekLunatic
Joined: 22 Feb 2003
Location: doncaster vic australia
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| God help Richmond if Nankervis goes down in a final and have grigg as ruck. Our full squad and we beat them yesterday. I hope someone knocks out rance soon the diving primadonna |
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swooper
Joined: 24 Sep 2002
Location: Melbourne
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| RudeBoy wrote: | | FWIW, I thought Langdon was terrific. He stood up and became our General down back, organising the defence. He showed great leadership. |
A real positive  |
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