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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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| ^ See MM's post above (7th comment on this page). |
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RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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| BazBoy wrote: | | With the players at our disposal—has Tom Jok been signed in any capacity |
He can't be signed yet. He'll go into the draft and try his luck with the other 600 hopefuls. |
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swoop42 
Whatcha gonna do when he comes for you?
Joined: 02 Aug 2008
Location: The 18
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I have our current points total at 1,033.
Even if pick 57 could be used for points which seems to go against what is listed in the CBA the final total would be 1,215.
Not sure how Twomey has arrived at 1,222 and if he can't get that right.....
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He's mad. He's bad. He's MaynHARD! |
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robevpau1 
Joined: 25 Mar 2008
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stoliboy
Joined: 15 Aug 2003
Location: Sydney, NSW
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Pies not off Beam on points
SMH: By Michael Gleeson
18 October 2018 — 8:08pm
https://www.smh.com.au/sport/afl/pies-not-off-beam-on-points-20181018-p50akw.html
What do all these numbers mean when it comes to players?
Unless Quaynor's name is called out by a club in the top 10 - highly unlikely - Collingwood will have enough points to cover his selection.
Even if he was called out earlier than expected, they could take him and draw on points from next year.
The likelihood is they have the points for Quaynor at the minimum, even if they exhaust all the points from their available picks. If by chance they had to soak up all their points on Quaynor, they could still go into deficit to secure Kelly.
Clubs are able to go into deficit in points the following year up to a maximum of 1723 points.
The likelihood is that, at worst, the Magpies might go into deficit a few hundred points. That would mean that their second round pick next year (they have traded their first pick next year, too, for Beams) might push back a few places in the draft, to account for the points they owe.
The bottom line is that there is some risk there in the event that both players' names are called out a lot earlier than expected, but that is doubtful. And even if they were, Collingwood would be able to go into deficit to cover it next year.
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AN_Inkling
Joined: 06 Oct 2007
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Yeah, I have no concern of the points needed to match Quaynor or Kelly. If they get called early that's good, it shows they're highly rated.
Worst case scenario is we go into deficit next year and our 2nd round pick blows out, not a big deal. There's no scenario where we miss out on them completely other than deciding not to match for whatever reason. If we want them, we'll get them.
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Well done boys!
Last edited by AN_Inkling on Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:34 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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masoncox
masoncox
Joined: 31 Aug 2015
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| 5 from the wing on debut wrote: | | MatthewBoydFanClub wrote: | | MJ23 wrote: | So, with two late teen picks we got.
1. Beams - A grade mid right now
2. Top 15 talent in Quaynor
3. Top 20 KPP and the best KPP in this draft
Not Trading for Beams and we would have got
1. Top 15 talent in Quaynor
2. Top 20 KPP and the best KPP in this draft
3. some random kid for a pick in the late teens next year
We Never had the currency for May unless we tipped out a Moore or another top 10 talent.
They have said a few times the priority was keeping out list together given the performance last year - I like that
We have Talented kids now that are going to have to work hard to get a game - which is good for the med/long turm. We have a heap og KPP kids now to develop.
Good result
I think we have been smart and done well |
If it pans out the way you say in either scenario I’m happy with the result. However if we go into points deficit to pick up Will Kelly, then it basically means that next year’s draft is a write off, unless we trade some players away next year.
Also another worry that I have is that our list is aging. We have aging mids now as well as aging KPP’s. We are moving the same way as Hawthorn and Geelong and opposite to the Western Bullogs who are rejuvenating their list after winning a flag.
I’m neither disposed one way or the other. It narrows the window to the next couple of years. We need to address the age on our list while giving opportunity to the youth on our list. I don’t think we can afford to delist McLarty when we have Dunn, Reid and Roughead having at most 2-3 years left in their careers. Also I hope there is still a senior spot in the team for Sier who is in the infancy of his career. An awful lot now depends on the two Irishmen, Madgen, Lynch, Appleby, the Brown brothers, Daicos and Crocker to press for senior selection. If at least half these players make it, then our list is healthy and will stretch out into the 2020’s. If not our list will struggle beyond the next couple of years like it did in the years following 2010. |
I see Sier's main competition for a place as an inside mid being Adams. Sier is a bigger, less experienced version who is still learning the game. I considered him to be BOG by half time in the GF. He has a great upside as he isn't yet fit and can't run out a game. Hopefully he will get a full pre-season in and go to the next level. If he gets himself fit he isn't going anywhere except into the ranks of our most important players. |
I thought I read that Siers only was on the ground 55% of the time in the GF.
So for you saying that he was near BOG by half time gives me great confidence in the young lad.
My current theory of AFL footy is that it is won in the the midfield.
You can pinch hit in defence and attack with decent structure but the midfield is where the bacon is at !!!!! |
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Pies2016
Joined: 12 Sep 2014
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| AN_Inkling wrote: | Yeah, I have no concern of the points needed to match Quaynor or Kelly. If they get called early that's good, it shows they're highly rated.
Worst case scenario is we go into deficit next year and our 2nd round pick blows out, not a big deal. There's no scenario where we miss out of them completely other than deciding not to match for whatever reason. If we want them, we'll get them. |
Agree and I can guarantee Hine and co will know where they will both be picked ( within a pick or two ) Its part of their job in all this.
They will know which clubs are right into both Q and K ( and all others ) and just check where the clubs relative picks are in the order. |
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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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That's an important detail I had not seen before. |
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On the March
Joined: 14 Feb 2004
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Regarding our rookie list.
My recollection is Josh T was elevated just prior to last season.If thats so he'll need to be so permanently for next season.
Max Lynch has had two years on rookie list so I think that means he has to be elevated (or re-rookied) keeping in mind he was re-contracted earlier this year.
Whilst it may seem obvious that Miocek should also be elevated there is no immediate need to do so. He has earned a new contract and can be kept on the rookie list for an another year. I think he would be in the same position as JT last year and elevated just before the season starts.
Nevertheless if we need to elevate these first two it may impact on the number of available spots on the list although the mix (number) of senior / rookie spots can vary.
I am wondering if Greenwood might get squeezed out.
Finally whilst we still have a need for a long term full back and possibly a tallish KF I'm not sure we are going to get that this year. Kelly will help as a KD. I am thinking we might target a small forward late in the draft.
Atu Bosenavulagi anyone? |
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MightyMagpie
Joined: 04 Jun 2013
Location: WA
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Mock draft using http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-10-14/cal-twomeys-phantom-form-guide-october and post-trade period indicative draft order.
Cal has our NGS/FS prospects rated a bit more highly than others I’ve seen so this probably provides a worst-case scenario for us regarding use of points.
I think I have the moving of live picks during the bidding process correct, but feel free to double-check.
1. CAR Sam Walsh
2. GCS Jack Lukosius
3. GCS Izak Rankine
4. STK Max King
5. PTA Bailey Smith
6. GCS Ben King
7. WBD Connor Rozee
8. ADE Bid for Nick Blakey matched by SYD. 1551 less 20% = 1241. Pick 26 (729) and 33 (563) cover that with 51 points remaining so 26 moved to end of draft order and 33 moves to 69.
9. [8] ADE Jye Caldwell
10. [9] GWS Jordan Clark
11. [10] PTA Jackson Hately
12. GWS Bid for Tarryn Thomas matched by NM. 1268 less 20% = 1015. Picks 42 [still 42] (395), 47 [still 47] (316), 48 [still 48] (302) and 49 [still 49] (287) cover that with 285 points remaining so 42, 47 and 48 moved to end of draft order and 49 moves to 50.
13. [11] GWS Zak Butters
14. GEE Bid for Isaac Quaynor matched by COL. 1161 less 20% = 929. Picks 41 [now 42] (395), 44 [still 44] (362), 51 [now 49] (287), cover that with 115 points remaining. Picks 41 and 44 moved to end of draft order and 51 moved to 63.
15. [12] GEE Riley Collier-Dawkins
16. [13] ADE Curtis Taylor
17. [14] FRE Ian Hill
18. [15] PTA Liam Stocker
19. ADE Bid for Rhylee West matched by WBD. 948 - 197 = 751. Picks 27 [now 29] (653) and 32 [now 34] (542) cover that with 444 points remaining so pick 27 moved to end of draft and pick 32 moves to 40.
20. [16] ADE Chayce Jones
21. [17] RIC Jez McLennan
22. [18] BRI Luke Valente
23. [19] GWS Sam Stuart
24. WCE Bid for Will Kelly matched by COL. 785 -197 = 588 points less pick 57 [now 55] (207) and 63 (115 points) leaving 266 points deficit.
25. [20] WCE Connor McFadyen
26. [21] ADE Edward McHenry
27. [22] WCE Xavier Duursma
28. MEL Bid for Bailey Scott matched by NM. 677 – 197 = 480. Remaining picks 50 [now 47?] (316), 55 [now 52?](246) and 58 [now 55?] (207) easily cover that.
29. [23] MEL Ely Smith
30. [24] GCS Xavier O’Halloran
31. [25] GWS
[26] SYD Used on Nick Blakey.
32. [27] WBD
33. [28] MEL
34. [29] GCS
35. [30] BRI
36. [31] FRE
37. [32] WBD
[33] SYD Used on Nick Blakey. Balance of 51 points so moves to 69.
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All We Can Be
Last edited by MightyMagpie on Sat Oct 20, 2018 12:29 am; edited 3 times in total |
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MightyMagpie
Joined: 04 Jun 2013
Location: WA
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| On the March wrote: | Regarding our rookie list.
My recollection is Josh T was elevated just prior to last season.If thats so he'll need to be so permanently for next season.
Max Lynch has had two years on rookie list so I think that means he has to be elevated (or re-rookied) keeping in mind he was re-contracted earlier this year.
Whilst it may seem obvious that Miocek should also be elevated there is no immediate need to do so. He has earned a new contract and can be kept on the rookie list for an another year. I think he would be in the same position as JT last year and elevated just before the season starts.
Nevertheless if we need to elevate these first two it may impact on the number of available spots on the list although the mix (number) of senior / rookie spots can vary.
I am wondering if Greenwood might get squeezed out.
Finally whilst we still have a need for a long term full back and possibly a tallish KF I'm not sure we are going to get that this year. Kelly will help as a KD. I am thinking we might target a small forward late in the draft.
Atu Bosenavulagi anyone? |
Since the new CBA Cat A rookies can play seniors with elevation so no need to elevate for that reason.
I haven't looked into the 2 year issue, but that does ring a bell. Worst case we can delist and try to re-rookie (risk being someone else drafts him).
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stoliboy
Joined: 15 Aug 2003
Location: Sydney, NSW
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I thought I would have a look at how common it is for clubs to bid on another club's Academy or Father/Son draftees.
2016 Draft:
- Will Setterfield (GWS Academy player) - Bid on by Carlton at pick 5... GWS matched the bid
- Jack Bowes (Gold Coast Academy player) - Bid on by Sydney at pick 10... Gold Coast matched the bid
- Harry Perryman (GWS Academy player) - Bid on by Adelaide at pick 14... GWS matched the bid
- Isaac Cumming (GWS Academy player) - Bid on by Sydney at pick 20... GWS matched the bid
- Declan Watson (North Melbourne Academy player) - Bid on by Brisbane at pick 34... North Melbourne did NOT match the bid
- Kobe Mutch (GWS Academy player) - Bid on by Essendon at pick 42... GWS did NOT match the bid
- Harrison Macreadie (GWS Academy player) - Bid on by Carlton at pick 47... GWS did NOT match the bid
2017 Draft:
On Wikipedia I couldn’t see any clubs bidding on another club’s academy players. Is this right?
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Sydney Collingwood Supporters Club
http://sydneymagpies.magpies.net/ |
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MightyMagpie
Joined: 04 Jun 2013
Location: WA
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| stoliboy wrote: | I thought I would have a look at how common it is for clubs to bid on another club's Academy or Father/Son draftees.
2016 Draft:
- Will Setterfield (GWS Academy player) - Bid on by Carlton at pick 5... GWS matched the bid
- Jack Bowes (Gold Coast Academy player) - Bid on by Sydney at pick 10... Gold Coast matched the bid
- Harry Perryman (GWS Academy player) - Bid on by Adelaide at pick 14... GWS matched the bid
- Isaac Cumming (GWS Academy player) - Bid on by Sydney at pick 20... GWS matched the bid
- Declan Watson (North Melbourne Academy player) - Bid on by Brisbane at pick 34... North Melbourne did NOT match the bid
- Kobe Mutch (GWS Academy player) - Bid on by Essendon at pick 42... GWS did NOT match the bid
- Harrison Macreadie (GWS Academy player) - Bid on by Carlton at pick 47... GWS did NOT match the bid
2017 Draft:
On Wikipedia I couldn’t see any clubs bidding on another club’s academy players. Is this right? |
You can go back to the old FS system as well. From memory WBD (?) bid on Darcy Moore so we had to take him with our next (high) pick. If he had slipped past our first pick we would have had two first round draftees that year.
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MightyMagpie
Joined: 04 Jun 2013
Location: WA
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If the pick 56/57 decision was a deliberate one then perhaps there are plans to snare a Hine special (an underager like Sier or an overager like Phillips) at this point in the draft.
If that's the case then I guess we end up with Quaynor, Kelly, Bosevulagi and a Hine special.
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