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inxs88
Joined: 17 Aug 2014
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Yawn
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I love the Pies, hate Carlscum |
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PyreneesPie 
PyreneesPie
Joined: 22 Aug 2014
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| think positive wrote: |
I agree. His upbringing surely had a huge part, I come from a far less than favourable childhood, and to this day I can see and feel the effects, and I didn’t live in the midst of civil war. However in light of recent events I’m not so sure he stretched the truth as far as I previously believed. I truly am wondering exactly what kind of culture and people are running Collingwood. Disillusioned, disappointed and embarrassed for a start. I have Info I won’t share re Treloar and it seriously makes me wonder on the people skills of those in charge, I feel like a bomber fan, we need a broom through the place. After a year from hell on so many fronts both personal and global, I’d really love my beloved Collingwood to give me something to look forward too. I ain’t seeing it yet. |
Yep TP, I too can fully appreciate the consequences of less than "favourable" childhoods 
It was brave of you to disclose that and to show you understand what I'm trying to explain re Heretier. (That certainly doesn't absolve Collingwood of its culpability however).
Good grief - I thought what went public about Adam's treatment was bad enough! I shudder to think it could be even worse  Like many here, I feel as though the club destroyed its soul through that debacle and with it, my previously unquestioned passion for Collingwood. I am waiting to see if that will ever return for me and for that to happen, that broom will probably be required!!! |
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Gerry Cooper
Joined: 23 Feb 2012
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| PyreneesPie wrote: | | stui magpie wrote: | | Whatever issues Heritier has, Collingwood didn't cause them. he's been on a self discovery journey for years now, rather than his viewpoint now I'd be interested in his viewpoint in another 10-15 years. |
A wise statement Stui!! He will have hopefully learnt a great deal more about himself with the passage of time - the person/human being he is and why.
He may have come to understand there are many other factors that have shaped him, in addition to his colour. For example, being uprooted to a new country at three years old and having no contact with his father growing up until he was 19. Such a situation would have its effects on any young man, be they white, black or yellow.
That's not to deny at all the impact of the racism he has undoubtedly had to endure. I suspect that Collingwood contributed to that, even if inadvertently and/or unintentionally.
However, so much of how we cope with/respond to the difficulties encountered along the way are determined by the events of our earliest years. Once that is understood, we have greater choice as to how we will respond in the future. The manner in which Heritier responded to racism certainly changed during his time at Collingwood and will probably adapt again, with a deeper understanding of his own personality and evolving maturity.
All that aside, Collingwood and the AFL can obviously improve in the ways they confront and deal with racism and bigotry. |
Maybe but the unaddressed racism was there in the first place. Hertier's reactions were merely the catalyst for it's exposure.
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We've all heard that a million monkeys banging on a million typewriters will eventually reproduce the entire works of Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet, we know this is not true.� |
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Pebbles Rocks
Joined: 28 Sep 2008
Location: Collingwood
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To provide some true balance to this whole saga, it would be interesting to read the full unadulterated view of those within the club during his time there.
Of course we will never hear it because it will be labelled as racist no matter how balanced it might be.
I am in no doubt that he experienced racism whilst at the club. However Heretier has never indicted he was interested in reconciliation. Surely for him to truly change the way racists think about people of colour he needs to consider how to engage and not feel the need fight the whole time?
Consider this:
"in its broadest sense ‘reconciliation’ means 'coming together'. The dictionary defines ‘reconciliation’ as a situation in which two people, or groups of people, become friendly again after they have argued.
In Australia, 'reconciliation' refers to bringing together Aboriginal people and non-Aboriginal Australians.
Reconciliation is not something that one decides to ‘do’ – it is a process, at the end of which there may be reconciliation, but this can never be guaranteed.
Reconciliation has elements of truth, justice, forgiveness, healing, reparation, and love.
Supporting reconciliation means working to overcome the division (often called "the gap") and inequality between Aboriginal and non-Aboriginal people."
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"You must be a parking ticket, cuz you got fine written all over you" Glen Quagmire |
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think positive 
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| Pebbles Rocks wrote: | To provide some true balance to this whole saga, it would be interesting to read the full unadulterated view of those within the club during his time there.
Of course we will never hear it because it will be labelled as racist no matter how balanced it might be.
I am in no doubt that he experienced racism whilst at the club. However Heretier has never indicted he was interested in reconciliation. Surely for him to truly change the way racists think about people of colour he needs to consider how to engage and not feel the need fight the whole time?
Consider this:
"in its broadest sense ‘reconciliation’ means 'coming together'. The dictionary defines ‘reconciliation’ as a situation in which two people, or groups of people, become friendly again after they have argued.
In Australia, 'reconciliation' refers to bringing together Aboriginal people and non-Aboriginal Australians.
Reconciliation is not something that one decides to ‘do’ – it is a process, at the end of which there may be reconciliation, but this can never be guaranteed.
Reconciliation has elements of truth, justice, forgiveness, healing, reparation, and love.
Supporting reconciliation means working to overcome the division (often called "the gap") and inequality between Aboriginal and non-Aboriginal people." |
ordinarily i would agree, however in this case i dont. He said he went to management more than once. the leso joke that was turned on to him, that is outright bullying hidden in the good old aussie "its just a joke". yes, at someones expense, for me thats not a joke. I can laugh at myself when i fall because im clumbsy, or say something completely stupid, but there are touchy subjects i dont laugh at. for me reconciliation is 2 parties who may have been in the wrong in parts, or 2 parties with different opinions, the very fact that others, and not all of them people of colour, any colour, came forward and said the nickname was used, whether he said it was ok or not, means this was NOT an equal fault relationship. I dont like the way he went about this, ive been very clear of that in the past, but im not in his shoes and i dont know what else he has tried in the past. Clearly other things in his life have contributed to his mental state, even if that state is all about hurt, its just not acceptable. To try and come across as a professional upstanding corporation, which by the look of that god awful Holden centre, is the look it wants, and allow this kind of in house bullying is just plain wrong. Boys will be boys - unless we say they cant. nope.
I think a big part of the problem is the litigation happy times we live in, im not sure every wrong deserves a payout, im not sure this one does or doesnt. I also dont want my beloved club to go under, but jezus is any one happy with recent events? Dont we all feel at least a little anger, embarrassment at the handling of more than just Treloar?
something stinks at Collingwood. and now im wondering just how deep that smell is.
Im pretty liberal when it comes to the term racism, i cant stand the words politically correct, however i grew up as a female immigrant and worked in a mans trade, with a quite frankly narcissistic brutal father, so im pretty thick skinned. But the older i get the more sensitive i am when people have a laugh because im deaf. Its not funny. its not kind, and its hurtful. Have i joined in in the past and contributed to the pain of others? no doubt. but these days i try very very hard to live by leave no footprint, unless its a good one. Just be kind. its not hard.
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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PyreneesPie
PyreneesPie
Joined: 22 Aug 2014
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Wow! One of the most profound statements I've read here on Nick's.
" I try very very hard to live by leave no footprint, unless its a good one".
So well said TP. |
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David
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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It is an excellent personal motto – it's one I cherish too.
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"Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence." – Julian Assange |
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RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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For one who has been closely involved with Indigenous communities in Central Australia for many years and who has many close Aboriginal friends, I don't tolerate racism from anyone. It is a scourge on humanity, wherever it occurs.
However, I also do not tolerate liars. There has been way too much which has come out of Heritier's mouth, which I consider slurs and untruths. As much as I loved him as a player, and as someone who spoke up on important social issues, his failure to ever accept responsibility for any of his own failures or mistakes, has led me to take anything he says with a grain of salt. Somehow, he always wants the attention on him.
He is an ex footballer. That's all. If he wants to do more with his life, then perhaps he needs to get a trade or go to University and put the hard yards in to get a degree. |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| PyreneesPie wrote: | Wow! One of the most profound statements I've read here on Nick's.
" I try very very hard to live by leave no footprint, unless its a good one".
So well said TP. |
cheers mate, i dont always succeed, and i cant always blame Jim beam for it when i fail, but i believe i have become a better person, ignoring the baiters and trolls helps, however i still also believe as kenny would say, sometimes you have to fight to be a man!!
| David wrote: | | It is an excellent personal motto – it's one I cherish too. |
agree
Rudey, as I said he has gone about this the wrong way, although im not sure what the right way would look like, and certainly, He needs to take a look in the mirror, some of his Harry exploits were not acceptable. I really wish the club would hash it out in some shape or form, because its not helping, him or us. I just want all the drama over, De Goeys court case will be the next fun thing. gees. i just want to sit my arse in the stands and cheer! guilt free!
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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MJ23
Joined: 28 Feb 2011
Location: Sydney
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couldn't read it all - far too much revisionism.
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"Even when Im old and gray, I wont be able to play but Ill still love the game"
Michael Jordan |
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