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think positive 
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| neil wrote: | What has pissed me off isnt the casual racism or who said what. It is not the fact that Collingwood has a racist past as does Australia. It is the fact that the Collingwood football club has not had a system in place to deal with racism.
This is not the 1970's when casual racism in the workplace was still the norm it is the 21 century. Every place I have worked in the last 20 years has had a no harassment policy with established procedures.
That Collingwood did not bring one into being until 2019 shows the size of the problem. |
yup
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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themonk
Joined: 02 Mar 2004
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| neil wrote: | What has pissed me off isnt the casual racism or who said what. It is not the fact that Collingwood has a racist past as does Australia. It is the fact that the Collingwood football club has not had a system in place to deal with racism.
This is not the 1970's when casual racism in the workplace was still the norm it is the 21 century. Every place I have worked in the last 20 years has had a no harassment policy with established procedures.
That Collingwood did not bring one into being until 2019 shows the size of the problem. |
Do other clubs have the policy? are we the last to implement? |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| themonk wrote: | | neil wrote: | What has pissed me off isnt the casual racism or who said what. It is not the fact that Collingwood has a racist past as does Australia. It is the fact that the Collingwood football club has not had a system in place to deal with racism.
This is not the 1970's when casual racism in the workplace was still the norm it is the 21 century. Every place I have worked in the last 20 years has had a no harassment policy with established procedures.
That Collingwood did not bring one into being until 2019 shows the size of the problem. |
Do other clubs have the policy? are we the last to implement? |
not the question that needs asking. We should do better regardless of our standing,
usually when something like this happens the woodwork opens, but i dont see many indigenous players form other clubs coming out into the discussions, do you?
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| What'sinaname wrote: | | No, when players aren't named, the club's name is tarnished. If the players were named, we would be talking about those players and their conduct and whether they are remorseful. Look at Michael Long and Damien Monkhorst. That was a Monkhorst, Long issue, not a Collingwood one. The young girl who called Goodes an Ape. We have an identity to discuss, not say this is a Collingwood supporter problem. |
Precisely. Individualising the problem. Krakouer doesn’t want to do that, and I respect him for it. What he’s saying is that it’s not just a [Player X] issue, and he doesn’t want it to become a [Player X] issue. Because the issues are much broader than that.
Honestly, the sooner the club and many of its supporters let go of their defensiveness, stop worrying so much about the club’s honour and start to care more about what’s being said and what can be done to fix it, the better.
_________________
All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| David wrote: | | What'sinaname wrote: | | No, when players aren't named, the club's name is tarnished. If the players were named, we would be talking about those players and their conduct and whether they are remorseful. Look at Michael Long and Damien Monkhorst. That was a Monkhorst, Long issue, not a Collingwood one. The young girl who called Goodes an Ape. We have an identity to discuss, not say this is a Collingwood supporter problem. |
Precisely. Individualising the problem. Krakouer doesn’t want to do that, and I respect him for it. What he’s saying is that it’s not just a [Player X] issue, and he doesn’t want it to become a [Player X] issue. Because the issues are much broader than that.
Honestly, the sooner the club and many of its supporters let go of their defensiveness, stop worrying so much about the club’s honour and start to care more about what’s being said and what can be done to fix it, the better. |
yup
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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PyreneesPie 
PyreneesPie
Joined: 22 Aug 2014
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| David wrote: |
Precisely. Individualising the problem. Krakouer doesn’t want to do that, and I respect him for it. What he’s saying is that it’s not just a [Player X] issue, and he doesn’t want it to become a [Player X] issue. Because the issues are much broader than that.
Honestly, the sooner the club and many of its supporters let go of their defensiveness, stop worrying so much about the club’s honour and start to care more about what’s being said and what can be done to fix it, the better. |
Yup X 2. You're on a roll today David!  |
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slangman
Joined: 11 Aug 2003
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| David wrote: | | What'sinaname wrote: | | No, when players aren't named, the club's name is tarnished. If the players were named, we would be talking about those players and their conduct and whether they are remorseful. Look at Michael Long and Damien Monkhorst. That was a Monkhorst, Long issue, not a Collingwood one. The young girl who called Goodes an Ape. We have an identity to discuss, not say this is a Collingwood supporter problem. |
Precisely. Individualising the problem. Krakouer doesn’t want to do that, and I respect him for it. What he’s saying is that it’s not just a [Player X] issue, and he doesn’t want it to become a [Player X] issue. Because the issues are much broader than that.
Honestly, the sooner the club and many of its supporters let go of their defensiveness, stop worrying so much about the club’s honour and start to care more about what’s being said and what can be done to fix it, the better. |
Generalising throws everyone into the same box which is pretty unfair and
disrespectful to the individuals within the club who don’t have a racist bone in their body.
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What'sinaname
Joined: 29 May 2010
Location: Living rent free
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| slangman wrote: | | David wrote: | | What'sinaname wrote: | | No, when players aren't named, the club's name is tarnished. If the players were named, we would be talking about those players and their conduct and whether they are remorseful. Look at Michael Long and Damien Monkhorst. That was a Monkhorst, Long issue, not a Collingwood one. The young girl who called Goodes an Ape. We have an identity to discuss, not say this is a Collingwood supporter problem. |
Precisely. Individualising the problem. Krakouer doesn’t want to do that, and I respect him for it. What he’s saying is that it’s not just a [Player X] issue, and he doesn’t want it to become a [Player X] issue. Because the issues are much broader than that.
Honestly, the sooner the club and many of its supporters let go of their defensiveness, stop worrying so much about the club’s honour and start to care more about what’s being said and what can be done to fix it, the better. |
Generalising throws everyone into the same box which is pretty unfair and
disrespectful to the individuals within the club who don’t have a racist bone in their body. |
Spot on. |
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3rd degree 
Joined: 22 Jun 2004
Location: John Wren's tote
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This story really upsets me that bloke's said this to Krak what a f%cking disgrace , Rock Against Racism.
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" Ohhh Banksy and out comes the Note Book".
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| slangman wrote: | | David wrote: | | What'sinaname wrote: | | No, when players aren't named, the club's name is tarnished. If the players were named, we would be talking about those players and their conduct and whether they are remorseful. Look at Michael Long and Damien Monkhorst. That was a Monkhorst, Long issue, not a Collingwood one. The young girl who called Goodes an Ape. We have an identity to discuss, not say this is a Collingwood supporter problem. |
Precisely. Individualising the problem. Krakouer doesn’t want to do that, and I respect him for it. What he’s saying is that it’s not just a [Player X] issue, and he doesn’t want it to become a [Player X] issue. Because the issues are much broader than that.
Honestly, the sooner the club and many of its supporters let go of their defensiveness, stop worrying so much about the club’s honour and start to care more about what’s being said and what can be done to fix it, the better. |
Generalising throws everyone into the same box which is pretty unfair and
disrespectful to the individuals within the club who don’t have a racist bone in their body. |
Is there a person alive who "doesn’t have a racist bone in their body"? Too many seem to be obsessed with who people are (i.e. racist or non-racist) rather than what they do.
Surely the only relevant thing here is that one of our very few Indigenous players in the last decade felt isolated as a result of aspects of the club’s culture, and didn’t have any pathway to getting such issues rectified when he was playing. That’s the headline here. But again, people seem to be more annoyed by the fact that he’s bringing it up, or that he’s not doing so in a way that they would find more satisfying or less confronting. But he’s not the one saying that so-and-so should be sacked, or the club should be boycotted, or that all Collingwood players are racist; he’s just talking about what happened to him and using it as an example of what he’d like to see changed for the better.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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themonk
Joined: 02 Mar 2004
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| think positive wrote: | | themonk wrote: | | neil wrote: | What has pissed me off isnt the casual racism or who said what. It is not the fact that Collingwood has a racist past as does Australia. It is the fact that the Collingwood football club has not had a system in place to deal with racism.
This is not the 1970's when casual racism in the workplace was still the norm it is the 21 century. Every place I have worked in the last 20 years has had a no harassment policy with established procedures.
That Collingwood did not bring one into being until 2019 shows the size of the problem. |
Do other clubs have the policy? are we the last to implement? |
not the question that needs asking. We should do better regardless of our standing,
usually when something like this happens the woodwork opens, but i dont see many indigenous players form other clubs coming out into the discussions, do you? |
So you seriously think this only happens at Collingwood and not at other AFL clubs?
😂 |
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slangman
Joined: 11 Aug 2003
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| David wrote: | | slangman wrote: | | David wrote: | | What'sinaname wrote: | | No, when players aren't named, the club's name is tarnished. If the players were named, we would be talking about those players and their conduct and whether they are remorseful. Look at Michael Long and Damien Monkhorst. That was a Monkhorst, Long issue, not a Collingwood one. The young girl who called Goodes an Ape. We have an identity to discuss, not say this is a Collingwood supporter problem. |
Precisely. Individualising the problem. Krakouer doesn’t want to do that, and I respect him for it. What he’s saying is that it’s not just a [Player X] issue, and he doesn’t want it to become a [Player X] issue. Because the issues are much broader than that.
Honestly, the sooner the club and many of its supporters let go of their defensiveness, stop worrying so much about the club’s honour and start to care more about what’s being said and what can be done to fix it, the better. |
Generalising throws everyone into the same box which is pretty unfair and
disrespectful to the individuals within the club who don’t have a racist bone in their body. |
Is there a person alive who "doesn’t have a racist bone in their body"? Too many seem to be obsessed with who people are (i.e. racist or non-racist) rather than what they do.
Surely the only relevant thing here is that one of our very few Indigenous players in the last decade felt isolated as a result of aspects of the club’s culture, and didn’t have any pathway to getting such issues rectified when he was playing. That’s the headline here. But again, people seem to be more annoyed by the fact that he’s bringing it up, or that he’s not doing so in a way that they would find more satisfying or less confronting. But he’s not the one saying that so-and-so should be sacked, or the club should be boycotted, or that all Collingwood players are racist; he’s just talking about what happened to him and using it as an example of what he’d like to see changed for the better. |
If AK intention was not to name and shame then he also could have just said that Collingwood didn’t have procedures in place to deal with issues that players and staff might have had without specifying racism.
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| ^ And then a whole lot of people on here would have dismissed his comments for being vague and unsupported by evidence of any problem that requires correction. |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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I didn't know the five stages of grief model would be applicable here, but yeah, looks like we've reached "bargaining".
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Mr Miyagi
Joined: 14 Sep 2018
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| slangman wrote: | | David wrote: | | What'sinaname wrote: | | No, when players aren't named, the club's name is tarnished. If the players were named, we would be talking about those players and their conduct and whether they are remorseful. Look at Michael Long and Damien Monkhorst. That was a Monkhorst, Long issue, not a Collingwood one. The young girl who called Goodes an Ape. We have an identity to discuss, not say this is a Collingwood supporter problem. |
Precisely. Individualising the problem. Krakouer doesn’t want to do that, and I respect him for it. What he’s saying is that it’s not just a [Player X] issue, and he doesn’t want it to become a [Player X] issue. Because the issues are much broader than that.
Honestly, the sooner the club and many of its supporters let go of their defensiveness, stop worrying so much about the club’s honour and start to care more about what’s being said and what can be done to fix it, the better. |
Generalising throws everyone into the same box which is pretty unfair and
disrespectful to the individuals within the club who don’t have a racist bone in their body. |
Leon talks about this in the latest Age article, that it’s unfair “champion blokes” get the reputation, but he also explains exactly what David thoughtfully wrote. It’ll be unfortunately messy at the start, thing is for us supporters to not take it personally (yeah I have trouble with that too!). |
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