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Post Match. Pies down to Dockers. All comments, please.

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Lazza 



Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Bendigo, Victoria, Australia

PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2021 9:34 pm
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simon tonna wrote:
Lazza wrote:
Do you think he was beaten by a better opponent or was it a careless attitude? I have worried about Grundy’s form consistency since his massive contract extension.


Lazza he’s careless attitude has been reworded as “he’s a different cat” or something along those lines. I also caught a glimpse of he and adams ignore each other after a Grundy goal. May be nothing to talk about but a contract like Grundys doesn’t go without enormous value expectations amongst peers.


Yeah I’m not the right person to discuss Grundy. Among my mixed mates of magpies and non magpies, only one other mate and I said that we should piss him off to Adelaide. Now I wish they did. I think he is a very talented footballer but seems to be “moody” about how he plays. I have wondered in many games if he merely goes through the motions 🥺 while in others he performs well. I don’t think that he will ever justify the salary he is on because I cannot see us winning a flag while he is at his peak. Maybe I’m wrong and we shall see him being an invaluable contributor in the fullness of time.😔

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JC Hartley Cancer

16 premierships now in the history books. Let's be the first club to 17 premierships.


Joined: 22 Dec 2008
Location: South Yarra

PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2021 10:44 pm
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In Robert Harvey's first game as coach since the departure of Nathan Buckley, Collingwood were competitive, yet numerous lapses of concentration and execution in defence allowed Fremantle to close out the game and prevail by 2 goals (12 points). In the opening term, the Magpies had the ascendancy early in general play, but conversion on the scoreboard kept the Dockers in it, who were then able to claim a slender lead at the first change. The second term was played almost entirely on Fremantle's terms where they put on significant scoreboard pressure, which Collingwood could not do during that period. After half time, the Woods found themselves staring down the barrel with a deficit of over 4 goals during the third term, before clawing back significant momentum until the Dockers hit back late in the quarter to establish a handy buffer of 18 points at the last change. The opening 5 minutes of the last quarter was all Collingwood, where they booted 3 goals to draw scores level within the opening 6 minutes, before a diabolical umpiring decision and 50-metre penalty gifted Freo the lead. The Magpies kept coming after that indiscretion and had the lead approaching time on at the 20-minute mark of the 4th quarter, until the Dockers had their kicking boots on when it counted to consign Collingwood to their most recent defeat. Of all the games that Freo have played this season, their goalkicking accuracy prevented Collingwood from getting Robert Harvey off to a flyer.

Collingwood won their statistical categories from disposals by +54 (400 - 346), kicks were won by +40 (238 - 198), handballs had a margin of +14 (162 - 148), while contested possessions were up by +4 (124 - 120), uncontested possessions had a differential of +62 (270 - 218), and +5 for intercept possessions (65 - 60). Hit-outs went Collingwood's way by +9 (29 - 20), tackles were won by +22 (56 - 34), with Tackles Inside 50 up by +7 (10 - 3). Uncontested marks were in favour of the Magpies by +36 (113 - 77), as were Contested Marks by +8 ( 16 - 8 ), while Marks Inside 50 had an advantage of +5 (14 - 9). Fremantle won their categories from clearances by +11 (34 - 23), with centre clearances up by +1 (14 - 13), while the Dockers doubled the stoppage clearances differential by +10 (20 - 10). The Dockers were then able to cap off their dominance from stoppages on the Inside 50s count, which they won by +4 (51 - 47).

Taylor Adams (32 disposals @ 59%, 491 metres gained, 15 contested possessions, 17 uncontested possessions, 2 intercept possessions, 19 kicks, 13 handballs, 4 marks, 6 tackles, 7 score involvements, 7 clearances, 3 centre clearances, 4 stoppage clearances, 9 Inside 50s & 2 Rebound 50s) won plenty of the ball in the clinches, but he made skill errors when he found time and space to dispose the ball effectively. Adams had 9 Inside 50s without being accurate nor effective whenever he pumped the ball inside 50 to Collingwood's forwards.

Jack Crisp (30 disposals @ 70%, 466 metres gained, 10 contested possessions, 20 uncontested possessions, 6 intercept possessions, 18 kicks, 12 handballs, 9 marks, 3 tackles, 6 score involvements, 7 Inside 50s & 2 Rebound 50s) continued his strong form in the midfield with a workmanlike performance. Supported Adams nicely throughout the game, although I would think the pair of them will need to work on the kick going inside Collingwood's forward line before their next game.

Scott Pendlebury (29 disposals @ 76%, 160 metres gained, 15 contested possessions, 14 uncontested possessions, 3 intercept possessions, 10 kicks, 19 handballs, 2 marks, 3 tackles, 5 score involvements, 8 clearances, 7 centre clearances, 4 Inside 50s & 2 Rebound 50s) had a high-volume game of handpasses that released teammates into open space and out of congestion of which he displayed exemplary poise. The Dockers were unfortunately able to reduce the amount of kicks that Pendlebury would normally have, which caused him to gain fewer metres with his possessions. Very solid game nonetheless from a skipper who leads by his actions all the time.

Steele Sidebottom (25 disposals @ 88%, 362 metres gained, 5 contested possessions, 25 uncontested possessions, 13 kicks, 12 handballs, 10 marks, 2 Marks Inside 50, 2 tackles, 1 goal assist, 7 score involvements, 5 Rebound 50s & 1 goal) played his best game in weeks, where he was sharper with his gathering skills and hit the vast majority of his targets in general play and kicked an early goal to get his confidence levels up. Kept working hard across the ground to be a marking outlet on the wings so his teammates could use him when he was available.

Brodie Grundy (22 disposals @ 68%, 219 metres gained, 9 contested possessions, 13 uncontested possessions, 3 intercept possessions, 27 hit-outs, 8 kicks, 14 handballs, 7 marks, 3 Contested Marks, 3 Marks Inside 50, 3 tackles, 7 score involvements, 2 clearances, 2 Inside 50s & 2 goals) made a reasonable return to AFL footy without dominating his position completely. It was nice to watch Grundy take more marks and have an impact on the scoreboard up forward. Grundy's clearance numbers were not acceptable, and I want him to take ownership of this element next weekend.

Will Hoiskin-Elliott (17 disposals @ 82%, 466 metres gained, 3 contested possessions, 14 uncontested possessions, 13 kicks, 4 handballs, 3 marks, 4 goal assists, 7 score involvements, 7 Inside 50s & 1 goal) had significant scoreboard impact from fewer disposals on the wing and across half-forward with plenty of goals created and chimed in with one major himself. Hoskin-Elliott was not able to take many marks, but that did not deter him from being a viable option to create chances.

Brayden Maynard (27 disposals @ 89%, 661 metres gained, 4 contested possessions, 23 uncontested possessions, 5 intercept possessions, 22 kicks, 5 handballs, 8 marks, 6 tackles, 3 score involvements & 6 Rebound 50s) was arguably Collingwood's best defender throughout the game by kicking long with accuracy, took marks to maintain possession, and applied excellent tackling pressure. Maynard should not have been penalised against Liam Henry for front-on contact, as Henry was the perpetrator who put his hands on Brayden Maynard's throat, which then resulted in that 50-metre penalty to gift the Dockers an easy goal.

Chris Mayne (24 disposals @ 92%, 198 metres gained, 5 contested possessions, 19 uncontested possessions, 7 intercept possessions, 16 kicks, 8 handballs, 10 marks, 2 tackles, 3 score involvements & 2 Rebound 50s) stuck to his limitations when he chose to kick or handpass the ball after he took his marks. Made good decisions to hit targets with short kicks to maintain possession instead of taking risks for greater rewards.

Jordan Roughead (19 disposals @ 95%, 216 metres gained, 2 contested possessions, 17 uncontested possessions, 6 intercept possessions, 15 kicks, 4 handballs, 13 marks, 2 score involvements & 3 Rebound 50s) demonstrated his aerial prowess and strength to expertly judge the flight of the ball to take his marks. Roughead chose the same path as Mayne to pass the ball safely without turning the ball over.

Jack Madgen (19 disposals @ 79%, 291 metres gained, 8 contested possessions, 11 uncontested possessions, 9 intercept possessions, 11 kicks, 8 handballs, 6 marks, 2 score involvements & 3 Rebound 50s) showed he could hold his marks. Despite this impressive display, he made a host of brain farts behind the ball that gave the Dockers every chance to kick goals.

John Noble (18 disposals @ 72%, 274 metres gained, 5 contested possessions, 13 uncontested possessions, 4 intercept possessions, 11 kicks, 7 handballs, 5 marks, 2 tackles, 1 goal assist, 2 Inside 50s & 2 Rebound 50s) took plenty of risks and showed plenty of dare. Usually those traits serve the team well. Against the Dockers, those traits went pear-shaped.

Nathan Murphy (15 disposals @ 87%, 181 metres gained, 3 contested possessions, 12 uncontested possessions, 4 intercept possessions, 8 kicks, 7 handballs, 8 marks & 2 tackles) backed himself in to take marks behind the ball, but did nothing else.

Darcy Cameron (15 disposals @ 73%, 164 metres gained, 7 contested possessions, 8 uncontested possessions, 4 intercept possessions, 2 hit-outs, 9 kicks, 6 handballs, 7 marks, 4 Contested Marks, 4 tackles, 2 Tackles Inside 50, 4 score involvements & 1 goal) kicked Collingwood's first goal of the game, and clunked plenty of marks to give his teammates a viable marking target to kick to from the midfield or half-back.

Josh Thomas (14 disposals @ 71%, 261 metres gained, 3 contested possessions, 11 uncontested possessions, 10 kicks, 4 handballs, 4 marks, 5 tackles, 2 Tackles Inside 50, 7 score involvements, 2 Inside 50s & 2 goals) made the most of his scoring opportunities, stayed involved in scoring chains and made an effort to apply tackling pressure up forward.

Brody Mihocek (13 disposals @ 62%, 192 metres gained, 7 contested possessions, 6 uncontested possessions, 10 kicks, 3 handballs, 7 marks, 2 Contested Marks, 2 Marks Inside 50, 1 goal assist, 8 score involvements & 1 goal) provided an option up forward, but he could not finish his work. Mihocek had 5 scoring shots for 1 goal. In recent years and some matches this season,
Mihocek would usually kick at least 3 goals from that many attempts, so it was exceedingly disappointing that his conversion was below par, and will look to atone for that display next week.

Trent Bianco (12 disposals @ 75%, 152 metres gained, 4 contested possessions, 8 uncontested possessions, 7 kicks, 5 handballs, 5 marks, 2 Marks Inside 50, 4 score involvements & 2 goals) had a relatively quiet game, but he showed he could impact the scoreboard up forward with two classy goals.

Collingwood's next game will be against St Kilda on July 4 at the MCG. As for the battle ahead, the Saints are a very enigmatic side that have not reached lofty heights aside from their shock victory over reigning premiers Richmond. Collingwood will need to match and overpower the Saints to ensure St Kilda do not continue their inspired form from their victory over the Tigers. The Magpies are yet to win a home game this season (all of Collingwood's victories have been in away games), so it would be bloody nice to achieve that and give Robert Harvey his maiden victory against the club he had played for with great distinction.

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Last edited by JC Hartley on Wed Jun 30, 2021 12:55 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Piesnchess 

piesnchess


Joined: 09 Jun 2008


PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2021 11:17 pm
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Great read, very good artlce, in depth look at the game, you did not miss a beat, very welll researched and written. Far better than anything Mark Robinson, Jon Ralph, Whateley or Caro write. Smile Surprised
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K 



Joined: 09 Sep 2011


PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2021 11:24 pm
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CarringbushCigar wrote:
...
Jack also disappointed a little but tried harder as the game evolved.
...

Which Jack? Crisp?
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watt price tully Scorpio



Joined: 15 May 2007


PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2021 11:25 pm
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^^ Quite right PNC re JC Hartley. Invariably a quality description. The only issue I have is he is too generous about Grundy. Darcy was a more effective ruckman than Grundy was.
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K 



Joined: 09 Sep 2011


PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2021 11:30 pm
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^ Must take a lot of effort each week. Well done, JCH.
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Rd10.1998_11.1#36 

rd10.1998_11.1#36


Joined: 18 Jul 2018
Location: Sevilla, Spain

PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 2:09 am
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mudlark wrote:

I note you didn't and don't mention Miochec. He's a liability and continuously lets the side down with his goal kicking.


Our leading goal kicker 3 years running, career 61% accuracy prior to the Freo game - that’s your idea of a liability?

His only problem is that too often he gets the best defender because we don’t have proper KPFs

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E 



Joined: 05 May 2010


PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 3:28 am
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Rd10.1998_11.1#36 wrote:
mudlark wrote:

I note you didn't and don't mention Miochec. He's a liability and continuously lets the side down with his goal kicking.


Our leading goal kicker 3 years running, career 61% accuracy prior to the Freo game - that’s your idea of a liability?

His only problem is that too often he gets the best defender because we don’t have proper KPFs
\

agree. To say Mihocek is a poor goal kicker is embarrassing. He is one of the most reliable goal kickers ever to don the black and white. He missed a few uncharacteristically in the past few weeks, but is a most reliable kick.

He and Elliot are elite goal kickers!!!

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Rd10.1998_11.1#36 

rd10.1998_11.1#36


Joined: 18 Jul 2018
Location: Sevilla, Spain

PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 5:43 am
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E wrote:
I think you have to imagine a team where the Cox money was spent on Lynch and the Beams money was spent on one of the star Mids in the comp.


We have to imagine it because it didn't happen. Don't think Lynch is on Cox money

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Rd10.1998_11.1#36 

rd10.1998_11.1#36


Joined: 18 Jul 2018
Location: Sevilla, Spain

PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 5:48 am
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Lazza wrote:
Not too sure anyone has said we were robbed


Pretty sure multiple people are saying the 2x 50s (given and not given) resulted in our loss, just as there are still people saying the Maynard block in the 2018 GF cost us a flag

Lazza wrote:
I thought the umpire was a bit too precious to call the 50... It was a more an under 10 umpiring call than at AFL level but the umpires are always trying to impress those officials who assess them from the stands so ultra technical decisions take place. BTW you can lock it in that this umpire never played cricket🙄 He would have cried if he heard some of the vicious sledging on a cricket field. Soft to me.


There's nothing "ultra technical" about giving a 50 for umpire abuse after refusing to give the ball back. Are cricket sledges directed at the umpire?

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DT 



Joined: 06 May 2007


PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 9:35 am
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Thanks JC Hartley.

My view is that Freo won more territory and controlled the game for longer periods. They shaded Pies on inside 50 entries and were a bit cleaner when entering F50. This reflects a more established style of play and more experienced players.

That said with De Goey returning next week the clearance and stoppage work will improve as will having Cal Brown out.

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Ronnie McKeowns boots 

Ronnie Mckeowns boots


Joined: 27 Jul 2020


PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 9:42 am
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simon tonna wrote:
Lazza wrote:
Do you think he was beaten by a better opponent or was it a careless attitude? I have worried about Grundy’s form consistency since his massive contract extension.


Lazza he’s careless attitude has been reworded as “he’s a different cat” or something along those lines. I also caught a glimpse of he and adams ignore each other after a Grundy goal. May be nothing to talk about but a contract like Grundys doesn’t go without enormous value expectations amongst peers.


Geez, one of those last centre bounces when the opposition ruckman just snatched the ball from him and kicked long...disappointing to say the least, needed to lock that ball in, and cost us a goal
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Magpietothemax Taurus

magpietothemax


Joined: 28 Apr 2013


PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 12:06 pm
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Rd10.1998_11.1#36 wrote:
Lazza wrote:
Not too sure anyone has said we were robbed


Pretty sure multiple people are saying the 2x 50s (given and not given) resulted in our loss, just as there are still people saying the Maynard block in the 2018 GF cost us a flag

Lazza wrote:
I thought the umpire was a bit too precious to call the 50... It was a more an under 10 umpiring call than at AFL level but the umpires are always trying to impress those officials who assess them from the stands so ultra technical decisions take place. BTW you can lock it in that this umpire never played cricket🙄 He would have cried if he heard some of the vicious sledging on a cricket field. Soft to me.


There's nothing "ultra technical" about giving a 50 for umpire abuse after refusing to give the ball back. Are cricket sledges directed at the umpire?


Rd10.1998, you made a special point of yelling at me because I dared to say that the umpire should have let the 50 m go due to the utter idiocy of his initial decision in penalising Maynard in the first place. But nowhere did I say that cost us the game. That was you who assumed that was what I meant. I let your comment go at the time, because I could see you were very angry at the time, which I understand. But now, 2 days later, I don't recall anyone claiming definitively that we would have won if that decision had not occurred.

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Raw Hammer 



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 12:07 pm
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Magpietothemax Taurus

magpietothemax


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 12:28 pm
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Thanks JCHartley for your painstaking analysis yet again. Always great to read it. I think you are right in expecting more from Murphy. It is great that he is taking marks behind the play, but needs to have more impact overall. i think you are right about Grundy as well. An OK performance after several weeks out, but needs to do better next week. His ruck work in particular needs to vastly improve, and he has Max Lynch breathing down his neck.
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