Nick's Collingwood Bulletin Board

think positive wrote:

droversdog65 wrote:Just looking at Trav over the season he seems to be in a place he is deeply unhappy about.

When all the bullshit, excuses and justifications are played through the base line is pretty simple.

Trav simply isn't a shadow of his former self.

The club simply can't afford to carry him in the AFL side and he is on record as saying he doesn't want to play VFL.

This last does it for me, a player sulking because he has been told he needs to get his act together in the twos?

NO Trav a million times NO.

He was never given a chance to prove himself after he was dropped. He was played out of position, until Darcy went down, and in that last game, with everything against him, he did not let us down.

He has no position, that's the problem.

Play him at full forward and he wants to goal square wrestle against two or three opposition players who just monster him.

Play up the ground and he won't apply pressure.

He used to be a player who was a definitive threat and forced opposition coaches to define their defensive strategies around stopping him. This hasn't been the case for years now and people need to face the fact that he is past his best.

Whether that is all in his head or not is beside the point.

Go back and watch the two '10 GF's.

We won that flag DESPITE Trav's 'contributions'.

A power forward unbalnaces a defense and kicks goals Trav does neither and hasn't for quite some time.

What I would do with Trav: he's on a lot less money, so that's a bonus, we won't get much for him apparently, so why not try and use his strengths?
Every day of the week against any team in the competition, if Trav is played near goal, he will take the number one or number two defender, and probably have number three hovering. This takes massive pressure off our forwards that can kick straight, most important of that lot is Moore. We need to protect his body, or he will end up like poor old Fraser. And he can still take a good mark, and even he can kick at least 50% from 15 out.

We desperately need someone special in defence, we cannot afford to bring Reid forward.

If my first idea fails, play Trav at half back. He can kick for miles, and from there, it doesn't matter if the kick is not in the range of 6.4 metres.

since so many think he's already washed up and we will only get spat out peanuts for him, why not give these suggestions a go?

I really think we are out of options for big Trav, I love the guy but he seems ineffectual most times.

Posting him at FF to draw the number 1 defender is a nice dream but I really do believe that ship sailed a year or two ago. We needed to draft a couple of decent specialist crumbers and failed to. Without someone at his feet those ground balls will continue to be swept up by smart teams that negate his marking and swarm the drop of the ball.

His best position I have always believed to be high forward, using his tank and bulk to spread the opposition. At his peak he was an awesome sight storming out at the ball - but that requires passion and the desire to do a job for his team and team mates, this Trav has undoubtedly lost.

He appears to me a man mentally and emotionally spent, a husk of his former self. He's been on the list for a looong time and has been a loyal servant but he's only here in body. The spirit and mind appear to be elsewhere.

This is a cancer in a team of young and impressionable players, an attitude and demeanour that is a direct contradiction of team spirit and is totally unnacceptable.

think positive wrote:

5150 wrote:

think positive wrote:What's gets me is, the Bulldogs are in the Grand final, they seem to think they have a spot for Cloke, we in 12 don't have a spot for him.

Uh huh! Makes perfect sense to someone I'm sure!

They don't have him yet. We still need that fourth rounder!

When they do, lets see how long it takes for him to deflate their side with costly set shot misses or cry to daddy and media when he gets dropped.

Or maybe we will see just what he can do with a coach who takes the time to understand and motivate him.

You will always achieve more building people up, than tearing them down. Even if you think it's not your job.

Nah, he wont straighten up on goals, its too late, wonder coach Beveridge cant turn that around. Actually, I will enjoy seeing him miss shot after soda shot, as he did with us, letting us down so many times at crucial times in games. Let us see him let down the Dishlickers time and again, as he did to us and our team.

Remembering Daisy's first game against us and how it affected him, I shudder to think about what that kind of atmosphere would do to Trav.

think positive wrote: Or maybe we will see just what he can do with a coach who takes the time to understand and motivate him.

You will always achieve more building people up, than tearing them down. Even if you think it's not your job.

They have brought people in to try and help Trav, they dropped him to the VFL so he can work out some confidence issues away from the pressure of the AFL and the media, and all that.

I think it's going to take a few weeks down in the VFL and with someone who can get inside his head and figure it out. Remember this isn't a new thing, it's been around for years now, even Trav tried to fix his problems with his own techniques and that didn't work for him.

The playing him in different positions is was to try and find him a place in the side, as the club clearly values him. If Cloke himself has no idea what his problem is, how is anyone else?

I think the massive contract put a lot of pressure on him, and everything else around him with the off field dramas that happened in the past, have rattled his head and dropping him back to the VFL where there isn't as much pressure was the best thing for him.

I think it came a little too late there, but if Cloke worked at it and worked with everyone trying to figure out his issues I think he can be fine. But it's going to take time in the VFL before he will ever be useful for them.

Maybe even some time away from football entirely.

Piesnchess wrote:

think positive wrote:

5150 wrote: They don't have him yet. We still need that fourth rounder!

When they do, lets see how long it takes for him to deflate their side with costly set shot misses or cry to daddy and media when he gets dropped.

Or maybe we will see just what he can do with a coach who takes the time to understand and motivate him.

You will always achieve more building people up, than tearing them down. Even if you think it's not your job.

Nah, he wont straighten up on goals, its too late, wonder coach Beveridge cant turn that around. Actually, I will enjoy seeing him miss shot after soda shot, as he did with us, letting us down so many times at crucial times in games. Let us see him let down the Dishlickers time and again, as he did to us and our team.

Go watch the 2011 Prelim.
I find your vindictiveness absolutely absurd.

Mr Cigar, it is not 2011, it will be 2017 next season. Cloke was a super player for us up until mid 2014, but as Robert Walls indicated Cloke is finished and has been for a couple of years. The modern game and the constant battering of his body year after year, game after game, has caught up with him.
We should be very happy to get whatever we get for him, as per Nathan Brown.

Mr Cigar, I didn't say he let us down, my exact words were that he was sensational for us up until mid 2014.
Unfortunately, as has happened to gun forwards like Brereton and Carey, their bodies getting battered game after game leads to them falling off the cliff very quickly.
I would suggest that you stop with the name calling, as it a default of someone that is lacking in evidence to support his/her arguments to get personal.

I see that post has already been deleted moret and understandably so.

CarringbushCigar wrote:

Piesnchess wrote:

think positive wrote: Or maybe we will see just what he can do with a coach who takes the time to understand and motivate him.

You will always achieve more building people up, than tearing them down. Even if you think it's not your job.

Nah, he wont straighten up on goals, its too late, wonder coach Beveridge cant turn that around. Actually, I will enjoy seeing him miss shot after soda shot, as he did with us, letting us down so many times at crucial times in games. Let us see him let down the Dishlickers time and again, as he did to us and our team.

Go watch the 2011 Prelim.
I find your vindictiveness absolutely absurd.

His last three seasons have been shite, or do you enjoy seeing him miss soda goals constantly and letting the team down. That, is absurd. The Dishlickers Welfare are welcome too him, he cannot hit the broad side of a barn door now.

I must admit that I can't work out exactly why the Welfare want him Piesnchess...

Cloke has been given every opportunity possible to improve and figure himself out. If the best resources available in the league can't help him then I'm afraid no one can.

The game has changed and evolved but Cloke hasn't; he's been left behind and finds himself in the position he's in now. Instead of going back to the vfl and finding form, he went through the motions because he didn't want to play vfl. Stiff bloody shit.

The more I think about it, the happier I'll be that he's gone. If he stayed he'd receive all the help available to work things through. He's taking the easy way out by leaving. He wanted the big money and got it but now he's a shadow of his former self. He's brought us many highlights over the years but I can't see how the dogs can help him and his game style.

Piesnchess wrote:

CarringbushCigar wrote:

Piesnchess wrote: Nah, he wont straighten up on goals, its too late, wonder coach Beveridge cant turn that around. Actually, I will enjoy seeing him miss shot after soda shot, as he did with us, letting us down so many times at crucial times in games. Let us see him let down the Dishlickers time and again, as he did to us and our team.

Go watch the 2011 Prelim.
I find your vindictiveness absolutely absurd.

Our last three seasons have been shite, or do you enjoy seeing us miss soda goals constantly and letting the fans down. o

I agree it's time to man up!

Piesnchess wrote:

CarringbushCigar wrote:

Piesnchess wrote: Nah, he wont straighten up on goals, its too late, wonder coach Beveridge cant turn that around. Actually, I will enjoy seeing him miss shot after soda shot, as he did with us, letting us down so many times at crucial times in games. Let us see him let down the Dishlickers time and again, as he did to us and our team.

Go watch the 2011 Prelim.
I find your vindictiveness absolutely absurd.

His last three seasons have been shite, or do you enjoy seeing him miss soda goals constantly and letting the team down. That, is absurd. The Dishlickers Welfare are welcome too him, he cannot hit the broad side of a barn door now.

No mate I've never enjoyed his erratic goal kicking, but accepted he is a fragile soul after about his 10th game.

His last three seasons have been twice as good as Jesse White who it seems will be carrying the hopes of emerging into our next premiership CHF.

I much rather keep proven premiership players like Cloke and Brown and many others and try a new coach. They have been as serviceable and black and white blooded as it comes, and they have had enough.
Supporters who react by saying - we don't need em, they are finished, get what you can for them or delist them make me sick.

Any dissent with the great Bucks and you are out of there.
The last 5 years are littered with broken relationships.

Cloke's talent is undeniable, his on-field effort has rarely been questioned and never in big games. He played some very good games for us in 2016, better than anyone else in the comp who was dropped 3 times.
Is it any surprise he got frustrated?

Im sick to death of players who don't want to be at Collingwood, and to me it is clear there is one common factor.
Every single piece of innuendo and circumstantial evidence points to the fact that the Collingwood FC is not as happy a place as it once was.

If you want a bet who will next win a final, I'll back Cloke over Buckley.

Who wants some action?