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luvdids
Joined: 22 Mar 2008 Location: work
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I don't get that one... what happened to the moth? And the guys mouth? The one that followed was equally hard to understand - dragging 2 pianos.
Sometimes I think not understanding how peoples minds work isn't a bad thing |
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David
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003 Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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I can’t quite explain – it’s a very famous short film from 1928 with a lot of surreal imagery, a lot of which doesn’t make much sense. In that clip I posted, the woman’s underarm hair disappears and ends up on the guy’s face, which seems to upset her a great deal. _________________ "Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence." – Julian Assange |
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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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If the film is very bad, does that make it "safer" or more "dangerous"?
Clown Prince of Crime makes joke of film award
https://www.theage.com.au/culture/movies/clown-prince-of-crime-makes-joke-of-film-award-20191002-p52wz1.html
"Joker is not a particularly good film, much less an important one. It is, however, an interesting cultural phenomenon: the Venice prize may represent a milestone in the history of taste, implying a new conception of quality cinema.
Whatever its pretensions, this is undeniably a comic-book movie; moreover it’s directed by the brazenly low-brow Todd Phillips, known for a string of wilfully tasteless comedies...
But the film pins most of its artistic hopes on Phoenix, playing yet another variant on the established Joaquin Phoenix Character: morose, potentially violent, inarticulate yet with glimmers of sensitivity.
...
Phoenix is the kind of actor who has to work hard to be uninteresting. But he never manages to make Arthur into a coherent person, partly because it’s hard to see this schmuck as any kind of future arch-villain and partly because the film’s thesis is kept broad and vague...
But this is not the sort of subject-matter Phillips knows how to handle..." |
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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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What’s the Panic Over ‘Joker’ Really About?
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/02/magazine/the-joker-movie.html
"In a slightly different culture, an art film about the Joker would be a premise for a comedy sketch. The beats write themselves... Taking a dumb idea very seriously is an evergreen comic conceit; in 1999 it might have been a sketch on MadTV.
In 2019 it is an opportunity to wring our hands. ...
Much of the criticism of the film has centered on the question of what effect it will have on such people. David Ehrlich of Indiewire called it “a toxic rallying cry for self-pitying incels,”... David Edelstein echoed the idea that “Joker” is “an anthem for incels” in his Vulture review, warning that the film is “scary on a lot of different levels.” At Slate, Sam Adams wrote that “no matter how emphatic Phoenix’s performance, it feels like a risk to feel too much for him, not knowing who might be sitting next to you in the theater using his resentments to justify their own.” Adams could handle this movie’s nuanced portrayal of self-loathing turned outward, but what about its effect on sexless losers?
...
It’s an anxiety that has led reviewers to condemn the kind of moral ambiguity that was supposed to distinguish art from crass commerce in the first place. Legitimate movies are about complicated protagonists who combine good and bad qualities; superhero movies are about two guys, one good and one evil. By combining them into a single guy, won’t this movie cause dummies to think the Joker is good? To ask the question is to argue that nuance is dangerous. By fretting over Arthur Fleck’s sympathetic qualities, progressive-minded critics are demanding the same sort of bright line between good and evil that makes comic-book movies so boring."
[But how would the author know this type of film can't encourage violent "dummies"?? He just doesn't want it to be true, so he refuses to consider even the possibility.] |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005 Location: In flagrante delicto
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It's not a superhero movie, it's a movie about a comic book bad guy.
As far as a bad movie, many critics are saying Pheonix has the Oscar in the bag.
If this runs anywhere near the John Wick movies for actual violence I'll go he.
There is a term for the lead character of a movie who is the hero but has little in the way of heroic qualities, the Anti Hero and it's been around for decades.
Some incel imbecile will probably go on a shooting spree wearing Joker makeup after watching it, but in the USA do they really need a coherent reason? _________________ Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Location: somewhere
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probably, but its just a prop for attention! gees, watch old war movies, or docos, there is an excuse everywhere you look! even home alone could be accused of setting some moron off! excuses excuses, is it the movies or the lack of gun control that has left people so desensitised to gun violence over there? id hazard a guess those 4D shootem up games with toy, but so lifelike, guns are a worse teaching tool. _________________ You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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David
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003 Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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K wrote: | What’s the Panic Over ‘Joker’ Really About?
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/02/magazine/the-joker-movie.html
"In a slightly different culture, an art film about the Joker would be a premise for a comedy sketch. The beats write themselves... Taking a dumb idea very seriously is an evergreen comic conceit; in 1999 it might have been a sketch on MadTV.
In 2019 it is an opportunity to wring our hands. ...
Much of the criticism of the film has centered on the question of what effect it will have on such people. David Ehrlich of Indiewire called it “a toxic rallying cry for self-pitying incels,”... David Edelstein echoed the idea that “Joker” is “an anthem for incels” in his Vulture review, warning that the film is “scary on a lot of different levels.” At Slate, Sam Adams wrote that “no matter how emphatic Phoenix’s performance, it feels like a risk to feel too much for him, not knowing who might be sitting next to you in the theater using his resentments to justify their own.” Adams could handle this movie’s nuanced portrayal of self-loathing turned outward, but what about its effect on sexless losers?
...
It’s an anxiety that has led reviewers to condemn the kind of moral ambiguity that was supposed to distinguish art from crass commerce in the first place. Legitimate movies are about complicated protagonists who combine good and bad qualities; superhero movies are about two guys, one good and one evil. By combining them into a single guy, won’t this movie cause dummies to think the Joker is good? To ask the question is to argue that nuance is dangerous. By fretting over Arthur Fleck’s sympathetic qualities, progressive-minded critics are demanding the same sort of bright line between good and evil that makes comic-book movies so boring."
[But how would the author know this type of film can't encourage violent "dummies"?? He just doesn't want it to be true, so he refuses to consider even the possibility.] |
That’s a really good article. Particularly like the final paragraph:
Quote: | Ostensibly too sophisticated for superhero stories, our critics have accepted the Joker’s power to corrupt the masses in real life, on a more literal level than the most addled comic-book fan ever would. That’s a failure to maintain critical distance, but it’s being projected onto an audience that critics imagine to be more suggestible than themselves — insanely more suggestible, almost comically so. Who are these people who will go to the multiplex this weekend and finally learn that violence is an option? Do they share the Joker’s conviction that society is one public gesture away from chaos? Or is that belief limited to critics? Critics, after all, are the ones warning us that millions of undersexed morons are about to watch a movie they won’t understand. And it’s critics telling us, in a tone of concern for their fellow man, that these losers are total misanthropes. |
_________________ "Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence." – Julian Assange |
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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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But it's not really about "critical distance", and so on. It's about forensic psychology. The issue is that not only do film guys have no idea about that but even the field of forensic psychology must not know with much certainty. |
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David
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003 Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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Everyone's just groping in the dark on this topic, K. Anyone who tells you different is lying. _________________ "Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence." – Julian Assange |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Location: somewhere
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David wrote: | Everyone's just groping in the dark on this topic, K. Anyone who tells you different is lying. |
I still vaguely remember that at the movies! _________________ You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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David wrote: | Everyone's just groping in the dark on this topic, K. Anyone who tells you different is lying. |
They all state opinions as if they know for a fact.
It doesn't fit well, though. There's been standard policy for decades about reporting of suicide in news or depiction in film. If that's good policy, it's hard to see how this stuff cannot possibly have any effect. |
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thesoretoothsayer
Joined: 26 Apr 2017
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Excellent origin story.
It's like Taxi Driver with clowns. |
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David
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003 Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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To be fair to the moral panickers, I did see this comment underneath a Facebook acquaintance’s post (in which he’d criticised the film) the other day:
Quote: | Hmmmm. ....
Instead of explaining mental health to you and what this film means to me and many others...
I'm just going to remain calm because like the movie, if I let narrow minded people like you get to me ...
They will and I'd do something about it... to people like you.
It's a struggle that's perfectly explained in this movie..
The nicest people are mostly the ones that are nice cause they are hurting inside or/and have been hurt so they wear a fake smile to get through the days..
You don't understand it so I won't let it cloud my mind and let the darkness in cause then it'd be coming for you..
Just sir.. you are wrong but the reaction you gave was the reaction people like me live with everyday from people like YOU that don't "get it" and you never will ...
If people like us let people like you get to us ...
Then there wouldn't be people like you left in this world .. for .. well ... reasons ..
Have a nice night and always wear your perfect world smile with your sheltered life
Abuse and torment is something you don't understand but if you keep typing shit like this .. you'll understand.. but at that time .. it'll be too late for you
So I'll just SMILE through your bullshit post and leave it as this..
If you don't understand something, then don't try to type an opinion on it mate cause you don't get it so don't try to say you do..
Cause hey ..
I'll come see you sometime and explain it in detail to you if you'd like as many others like me would do the same if you keep running your mouth (or thumbs that aren't hard to cut off in this case)
So
Peace dude ..
Go watch something else ..
This movie ISN'T FOR PEOPLE LIKE YOU. |
I’m not generally in favour of the surveillance state, but I kind of hope someone’s keeping tabs on this guy. _________________ "Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence." – Julian Assange |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Location: somewhere
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Nah my reaction is to want to give him a hug.
Lucky is the person who has never ever known even a day of darkness _________________ You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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Nah, TP, save your hugs for me. |
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