Transgender athletes back on the agenda

[stui magpie]

Kiwi weightlifter Laurel Hubbard has dominated her first major competition, taking out the Australian International in Melbourne on a night she made history as the first transgender athlete to represent New Zealand.

Hubbard, 39, won the women's over 90kg division at the Melbourne event, setting four unofficial national records in the process. Hubbard lifted a combined total of 268kg - 19kg better than silver medallist Iuniarra Sipaia of Samoa.

Australia's Kaitlyn Fassina claimed the bronze medal with 223kg.

Hubbard looked visibly emotional as she lined up behind dais awaiting the official medal presentation. But she kept the tears at bay, smiling and waving as she stood atop the podium.

Earlier this month the Herald revealed Hubbard had been selected to make her international debut at the competition after usurping Rio Olympian Tracey Lambrechs at the top of the division.

Hubbard's selection was a considered a pioneering moment in sport for the LBGT community. Further ground could yet be broken, with tonight's performance in Melbourne expected to go a long way to securing Hubbard's place in the team for the Gold Coast Commonwealth Games next year.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/ar ... d=11821399

Apparently both her and the NW weightlifting mob have ensured that every box has been ticked, in particular her testosterone levels.

however, the argument about fairness has again been raised particularly in light of her age at debut (39) and that she transitioned in her early 30's.

I don't have an opinion really on this, I can see both sides of the argument.
Did spending the first 30+ years as a male and competing at a national level in mens weightlifting during that time give her an unfair advantage once she transitioned?

https://au.news.yahoo.com/a/34720066/ki ... ors/#page1

It's not like she transitioned first then took up a sport.

She's legally female and ticked all the boxes to compete, but is it "fair"?


(NB, I have a reasonably well documented disdain for people who throw up arguments about fairness. It normally comes from basic jealousy that someone has something that they don't. I added this as a qualifier, lets see how many people can't get past it.)

[David]

To paraphrase a post from another Nickster in an earlier thread about this topic, should we ban East Africans from distance running events, where they seem to have a clear physical advantage over everyone else?

A transgender woman may, in some cases, have certain physical advantages over other women. Likewise, Patrick Dangerfield has a physical advantage over Josh Daicos, and Serena Williams has a physical advantage over Samantha Stosur. Such is competitive sport. Beyond that, anyone who is legally a woman is a woman and, if she's good enough, deserves the chance to compete in her sporting code at the highest level.

[Skids]

[David]

[Skids]

[think positive]

edit, in response to David: i dont think its that black and white (is that racist!!)
She transgendered in her early thirties, certainly would have had all the male body advantages by that time. Who knows how much was lost in the change?

the comment in the article about her looking visibly emotional is not necessary, anyone who wins gold could be so effected.

Yes no doubt shes had a tough time, didnt change just to win a medal, but spare a thought for the women who have trained, given their all, taken the correct steroids, whatever, to get to the top. im not sure i want to tell them to "deal with it". its not just strength, its speed, its jumping, its all of it, something a male body is more tuned to do than a female body, and some of those attributes dont go away.

and just for your info, that 229cm basketballer may have a height advantage, but put talented defenders around him, and he might not be able to move to get the ball, its a team event, you can strategise around it, its not a game built purely one on one, seen it on the court many times. a one on one competition is going to be so different. you cant compare.

part of your last paragraph David,
"So long as sporting organisations are sufficiently convinced that a trans woman is actually legally a woman and has gone through the required steps to demonstrate that she is committed to this transition, then they are right to let her compete in her sporting code of choice."

the question Stui asked was:

She's legally female and ticked all the boxes to compete, but is it "fair"?

lots of things in life are legal but not fair, fair is probably an opinion rather than a set way of thinking,

IMO its not fair. and if it was me in second spot, id feel ripped off.

you often put yourself in the scenario, as in," im not very big, women could beat me, im not calling not fair" but if you entered that sport and didnt prepare appropriately, then its stupidity not fairness.

if an athlete does the best they can, and still gets beat fair and square, youd hope they would be gracious about it. if an athlete has done the best they can and is beaten by say, those chinese swimmers for example, thats not fair, not legal either mind you. just because the law states the medicine they take to transform is legal, doesnt make it fair.

thats answering the question asked. not the question you made it in to.

[luvdids]

(NB, I have a reasonably well documented disdain for people who throw up arguments about fairness. It normally comes from basic jealousy that someone has something that they don't. I added this as a qualifier, lets see how many people can't get past it.)

IMO its not fair. and if it was me in second spot, id feel ripped off.

[David]

[think positive]

i was being a smart arse with the steroids use thing, its cheating, essendon cheated, cheating isnt fair.

performance maybe reduced, but is it reduced enough and across the board?

rights. everyone wants, has, needs rights.

but they aint reserved just for minority groups.

those female athletes have a right to compete on an equal playing field, and competing against someone who used to be a male with all the extra abitlity that allows for, is not fair.

[think positive]

(NB, I have a reasonably well documented disdain for people who throw up arguments about fairness. It normally comes from basic jealousy that someone has something that they don't. I added this as a qualifier, lets see how many people can't get past it.)

IMO its not fair. and if it was me in second spot, id feel ripped off.

yes thanks, i saw his disclaimer however as i also pointed out to David the question is the bit with the question mark on the end, and the question was IS IT FAIR?

and i also pointed out that fair is really an opinion thing, not an exact science.

and i can also assure you i have never had any kind of desire, burning or otherwise, to possess a dick, not even when peeing in the bush, so not sure what you think i might be envious of?

[David]

[think positive]

[stui magpie]

[stui magpie]

[Bucks5]